TV alert: Tonight (Sunday May 24) on ESPN - new 30 for 30: "Lance"

Bazza

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ESPN's 30 for 30 "LANCE," directed by Marina Zenovich
Part 1:
Sunday, May 24, 9 p.m. ET on ESPN.
Part 2: Sunday, May 31, 9 p.m. ET on ESPN.
Livestreaming: ESPN App, ESPN+ and ESPN Player (where available)

I've been a huge fan of professional cycling for many years and can't be the only one here, I'm sure.

Not happy at all that Lance cheated - but I look forward to this 30 for 30 documentary, as they always do a fantastic job.

 
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81usaf92

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I've never seen a bad 30 for 30. ESPN kills these mini docs.
Roll Tide War Eagle was a subpar project imo. It gave an extremely limited take on the rivalry as a whole, and painted Harvey Updike as a typical Bama fan. It should’ve really been about the Toomers oaks poisoner because that was mostly what they wanted to talk about.
 

crimsonaudio

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Roll Tide War Eagle was a subpar project imo. It gave an extremely limited take on the rivalry as a whole, and painted Harvey Updike as a typical Bama fan. It should’ve really been about the Toomers oaks poisoner because that was mostly what they wanted to talk about.
Never watched that one, so I stand by my statement. :)
 

Con

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ESPN's 30 for 30 "LANCE," directed by Marina Zenovich
Part 1:
Sunday, May 24, 9 p.m. ET on ESPN.
Part 2: Sunday, May 31, 9 p.m. ET on ESPN.
Livestreaming: ESPN App, ESPN+ and ESPN Player (where available)

I've been a huge fan of professional cycling for many years and can't be the only one here, I'm sure.

Not happy at all that Lance cheated - but I look forward to this 30 for 30 documentary, as they always do a fantastic job.

I love watching the Tour de France every year. I like the mountain stages better than the others. I hate that Lance Armstrong chested too but he is the reason I started watching and riding in the first place. I will definitely watch this 30 for 30 as well.
 

B1GTide

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I love watching the Tour de France every year. I like the mountain stages better than the others. I hate that Lance Armstrong chested too but he is the reason I started watching and riding in the first place. I will definitely watch this 30 for 30 as well.
Every great cyclist for the past 30+ years has been cheating. Lance just did a better job of it.
 

Bazza

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Sorry about all the F-bombs.......looks like they are airing an edited version on ESPN2, as they did with "The Last Dance".

30 for 30 doing a great job again......
 

4Q Basket Case

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The cheating isn’t what bothered me that much about him. As others have posted, it was the way things were done at the time. Still, no problem with his being stripped. Just strip everybody who cheated.

What really got under my skin was the personal destruction he left in In his wake, trying to maintain the aura of LANCE ARMSTRONG, and associated invincibility.

He trashed people and ruined lives with accusations he knew to be false when he made them, simply because he wanted to protect his image.

People were destroyed because he was trying to protect a self-centered lie. That’s where I part ways with Mr. Armstrong.

I don’t envy him when the day comes he answers for that to Someone who has no need of a lie detector.
 

CrimsonTheory

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I've no interest in anything auburn, so I'll continue to pass on it.
Same here. Tired of ESPN tying Alabama and Auburn together. ESPN does not have enough tape to discuss UA/West Georgia rivalry properly. I would love to see a "30 for 30" about Saban's continuing dynasty at Alabama.

Every great cyclist for the past 30+ years has been cheating. Lance just did a better job of it.
I agrree with 4Q. The cheating did not bother me because quite frankly Lance was surely the only one cheating, just the biggest name to get caught. (Though the French taking great pleasure at bringing down an American did not please me either.) It's his ruthless aggression to perserve his "name" that bothered me.

With that said, without Lance, would anybody outside of cycling fans even give the Tour de France any attention? When the Tour de France comes up, I do something more exciting like painting walls, watch meTV, or watch soccer. Sorry cycling fans.
 

81usaf92

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Same here. Tired of ESPN tying Alabama and Auburn together. ESPN does not have enough tape to discuss UA/West Georgia rivalry properly.
Well I think they could've done a good job with the rivalry, but they picked the wrong way to go about it.

1) First they picked Martin Khodabakhshian to direct the program. Someone that has never had to live the rivalry. As much as I dislike Finebaum, I believe he would've been the obvious choice since he has lived through the rivalry as a neutral fan. They could've picked so many people that lived as neutral fans in the state, or atleast someone who was from the deep south who understood the rivalry to direct it, but they gave a non resident his first production on a subject that you really need to experience to understand

2) Secondly, the only time it ever seemed to resemble a documentary about the rivalry was when they had Bill Curry, shaun alexander, Bo Jackson, Pat Dye, and David Housel on the program. That was about 20 minutes of an hour and half program.

3) Finally they really only wanted to focus on a period of September 5th, 2009- May 2011 There are two problems with that.

One problem is that isnt even a great period that really describes the rivalry even for that time. I would argue that the rivalry really was never more fierce than it was from 1981-1990. Maybe @selmaborntidefan has a different period of a time in his wealth of knowledge, but the 80's are probably with Dye are probably where the real rivalry began. I mean, moving the game out of Birmingham, 315, Bo over the top, and Van Tiffin all happened in a matter of 9 years. The 2009 game is memorable, but lets be honest in that the Florida game that year and the 2008 game are far more cherished games to Alabama fans than Gmac making a last minute drive (really longer than that) to win a game against a mediocre Auburn team.

The other problem is that it really paints Auburn as the good guys and Alabama as the bad guys. Not mentioning Updyke wouldve been bad journalism, but actually having him on the program and labeling him as an "Alabama Super Fan" is just wrong on so many levels. They even had to have the audacity to mention Auburn's efforts to help Tuscaloosa recover from the Tornado and never made any mention of the Tide for Toomers effort. It more or less made the program into an Auburn propaganda film.
 
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92tide

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I love watching the Tour de France every year. I like the mountain stages better than the others. I hate that Lance Armstrong chested too but he is the reason I started watching and riding in the first place. I will definitely watch this 30 for 30 as well.
i grew up watching the tour and followed it fairly regularly until the whole doping thing with lance. then i quit caring enough to follow.

i loved it when in 2001 (i think) he put the hammer down and dropped ulrich like a bad habit on one of the nastier climbs.
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Roll Tide War Eagle was a subpar project imo. It gave an extremely limited take on the rivalry as a whole, and painted Harvey Updike as a typical Bama fan. It should’ve really been about the Toomers oaks poisoner because that was mostly what they wanted to talk about.
That rivalry makes a compelling story, but you're right - it was marred by way too much Harvey. They DID have to tell the story because it was contemporary - but they let it overtake the whole thing. And putting his face on there and interviewing him with that Texas hick accent and him trying to pretend it was a Tommy Lewis thing was just plain nuts.
 

selmaborntidefan

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Well I think they could've done a good job with the rivalry, but they picked the wrong way to go about it.

3) Finally they really only wanted to focus on a period of September 5th, 2009- May 2011 There are two problems with that.

One problem is that isnt even a great period that really describes the rivalry even for that time. I would argue that the rivalry really was never more fierce than it was from 1981-1990. Maybe @selmaborntidefan has a different period of a time in his wealth of knowledge, but the 80's are probably with Dye are probably where the real rivalry began. I mean, moving the game out of Birmingham, 315, Bo over the top, and Van Tiffin all happened in a matter of 9 years. The 2009 game is memorable, but lets be honest in that the Florida game that year and the 2008 game are far more cherished games to Alabama fans than Gmac making a last minute drive (really longer than that) to win a game against a mediocre Auburn team.
I'm in about 99% agreement with everything you said in the post (probably no surprise, heh heh).

The problem with the Iron Bowl rivalry is.......well, it's an asymmetrical rivalry.

Auburn loves to beat Alabama; Alabama fears losing the IB more than we enjoy winning it.

The Iron Bowl rivalry is pretty much the Yankees/Red Sox "rivalry" in that the powerhouse wins most of the games and virtually all of the championships while the lesser party wins mostly when the powerhouse is down. I'm guessing they chose the 2009 and 2010 seasons because both teams won titles, but the bizarre thing is that without: 1) the Cam Newton scandal; and 2) the Harvey scandal.......there is literally nothing to the documentary AT ALL.


An accomplished writer - hell, combine the talents of Lars Anderson and Phillip Marshall if you have to - could have told a compelling story, including why the two schools went four decades without playing each other. But what was the first REAL shot in the war? Was it Auburn winning the 1957 national title (while on probation)? Because the next big moment in the rivalry - at least from my "not yet born" vantage point - was the 1972 punt game. One great moment in 15 years is not exactly a rivalry by my count.

And then Auburn didn't even win the IB again for another decade, so you've got a 25-year span of one golden (er, blue and auburn) moment surrounding a bunch of losses to a six-time national champion. And you can write a FAIR story about how in a large sense Auburn is a usurper to Tennessee as the Tide's biggest rival.


Having lived through it, I concur with your assessment. The golden age of the Iron Bowl - really - was from 1981 to 1994, Bryant winning 315 through Terry Bowden's first loss as head coach. This period includes:
- Bryant winning 315 in a game where Auburn vastly outplayed Alabama led by a former Bryant asst
- Bo over the top
- Bo runs like wild and Auburn wins their first SEC title since pre-Bryant
- Wrong way Bo
- Van Tiffin
- Lawyer Tillman's reverse
- Joab Thomas appealing to the SEC to make the game on a rotational basis
- Dye moaning until he could get the game moved to Jerking Hare (big story there)
- Auburn winning the first home edition of the IB
- Langham's pick six en route to a national title
- the entire Eric Ramsey scandal that put Auburn on probation
- the hiring of Terry Bowden and his 21-game unbeaten streak
- the concurrent pending probation of Alabama due to the Langham affair

That was the real big period of intensity. You COULD conceivably add through 1997 and poor Ed Scissum.

But the games from 1998 through 2008 were among the most forgettable in any rivalry anywhere. Save for the back to back "upsets" (which time has proven weren't really upsets) in 2001 and 2002, the games weren't even overly compelling or interesting save for the first half of 2004.
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Every great cyclist for the past 30+ years has been cheating. Lance just did a better job of it.
Well, and he had help.

I've long said my beef with the treatment of Ben Johnson is the fact he got blasted from one end of the earth to the other over using drugs - something FIVE OF THE OTHER SEVEN racers were doing. (No, they weren't all using stanzolol, but they were using various PEDs).

I've long suspected the USOC covers up stuff due to the fact without the USA there's no money in the Olympics (it's like Brazil will the World Cup - okay, not exactly). I suspected it way back in 1988, and eventually (around 2013) it came out.

Look, Ben Johnson cheated and finished first, and he has to lie in the bed he made. But to watch Carl Lewis stand there all self-righteous spitting out how "I knew Ben was dirty" when HE HIMSELF was taking stuff......I'm not surprised, but his hypocrisy will always bother me more than Ben Johnson doing the drugs did. And the American media let him get away with it.


The day I got suspicious - more than suspicious I guess - about Armstrong was when Floyd Landis won and then suddenly came up positive. I thought, "Yeah, that's the crack in the loyalty right there - here it comes." But Landis was every bit the jerk Armstrong was, Lance was just better at handling a media willing to give him a pass because of his history of cancer.


I've decided pretty much all of our athletics competitions are dirty - top to bottom. And yes, I include college football in that, of course.
 

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