More and more economist are coming out against Stimilus Bill.

[TRUTIDE]

It seems that the more that is revealed about this bill, the more economist are speaking out against it. It is like a new batch speaking out everyday. A lot of the ones that supported it initially are now downgrading their earlier predictions or reversing them altogether. Now the dems are not even going to give us a chance to go over the new bill they are ramming down our throats.

Democratic Senator Predicts None of His Colleagues 'Will Have the Chance' to Read Final Stimulus Bill Before Vote

Wakeup America!

Libertarian ideas to stimulate economy

Another reason that some analysts frown on the stimulus is the social spending it includes on things such as the Head Start program for disadvantaged children and aid to NASA for climate-change research. Both may be worthy efforts, but they aren't aimed at delivering short-term boosts to economic activity.

With the House poised to vote as early as today on the measure, analysts are slashing their estimates of its ability to counteract a deepening recession, with several prominent economists now saying the package will save or create fewer than 2.5 million jobs by the end of next year.

It ignored over 200 economists, including several Nobel laureates, who signed a full-page ad that ran in The Times on January 26 declaring that they did not "believe government spending is a way to improve economic performance."

And then there's this..,

D'oh! Caterpillar CEO Contradicts President on Whether Stimulus Will Allow Him to Re-Hire Laid Off Workers

 

[Mamacalled]

It seems that the more that is revealed about this bill, the more economist are speaking out against it. It is like a new batch speaking out everyday. A lot of the ones that supported it initially are now downgrading their earlier predictions or reversing them altogether. Now the dems are not even going to give us a chance to go over the new bill they are ramming down our throats.

Democratic Senator Predicts None of His Colleagues 'Will Have the Chance' to Read Final Stimulus Bill Before Vote

Wakeup America!

Libertarian ideas to stimulate economy

Another reason that some analysts frown on the stimulus is the social spending it includes on things such as the Head Start program for disadvantaged children and aid to NASA for climate-change research. Both may be worthy efforts, but they aren't aimed at delivering short-term boosts to economic activity.

With the House poised to vote as early as today on the measure, analysts are slashing their estimates of its ability to counteract a deepening recession, with several prominent economists now saying the package will save or create fewer than 2.5 million jobs by the end of next year.

It ignored over 200 economists, including several Nobel laureates, who signed a full-page ad that ran in The Times on January 26 declaring that they did not "believe government spending is a way to improve economic performance."

And then there's this..,

D'oh! Caterpillar CEO Contradicts President on Whether Stimulus Will Allow Him to Re-Hire Laid Off Workers

Heck, Even the CBO (Congressional Budget Office for those educated in Social Sciences) said that doing nothing would do more than what this package would do.
Just say that this bill does create the 3 million jobs that they hope to create (even though Obama and his minions have failed to show any study that would back up their hopes). It comes to $300,000 for every job created! Heck, give me $300,000 and I will be glad to go and open my next restaurant and I will gurantee you atleast 20 new jobs created. With the 20 jobs that I create with the $300,000, I will gurantee that $300,000 will be put back into the economy in the first year alone with just my payroll This does not include all of the new equipment, construction and purchasing of product to be sold.
Naw, creating a national medical database of everyone's medical records is more stimulating.

 

[LCN]

Stimulus ? Not hardly

Well , it has already stimulated some noticeable inflation at the grocery store .

 

[RhodeIslandRed]

You know, to put things in perspective, last summer I had heard that the market value of all of the real estate in the United States is approximately $5 trillion. Well, we're talking about spending $3 trillion already. Well, why not go ahead and pay off everyone's real estate mortgage pronto. That should stop any more mortgage defaults and stop any more credit default swap derivatives from executing. Then the recession will be solved.

 

[Pluck and Grit]

You know, to put things in perspective, last summer I had heard that the market value of all of the real estate in the United States is approximately $5 trillion. Well, we're talking about spending $3 trillion already. Well, why not go ahead and pay off everyone's real estate mortgage pronto. That should stop any more mortgage defaults and stop any more credit default swap derivatives from executing. Then the recession will be solved.

If the politicians cared enough, they could do that. But they are more interested in their power. So in order to keep that power, they use the government treasury to fill up a trough at which those who keep them in power can feed. They call the feed that's going in the trough a "stimulus" bill. They say it will stimulate the economy. Sooner or later, the economy does get better, somehow or another. At that point, the politicians crow about how their "stimulus" bill caused it to happen.

The maddening thing is that some percentage of the electorate will believe it when the politicians claim the credit for the economy through their "stimulus" bill, and keep voting them back into office, so that the scam keeps getting perpetuated.

If there's a moral to all this, or a lesson to be learned, I'd say that it's a good idea to set yourself up to be one of those who gets to feed at the trough.

 

[Ldlane]

Pick your poison:

Republicans - Spend our money in Iraq, a country with no democratic institutions or foundations on a pipe dream that "democracy" will be exported.

or

Democrats - Spend our money in our country where there might be a bit more hope of something coming our way.

The bottom line is that either are going to spend "our" money on their pet projects!

 

[NYBamaFan]

You know, to put things in perspective, last summer I had heard that the market value of all of the real estate in the United States is approximately $5 trillion. Well, we're talking about spending $3 trillion already. Well, why not go ahead and pay off everyone's real estate mortgage pronto. That should stop any more mortgage defaults and stop any more credit default swap derivatives from executing. Then the recession will be solved.

The estimated value of all US residential real estate peaked in 2006 at just about 25 trillion dollars. That is now down about 25%, but that still leaves it at 18 trillion dollars - and that is just residential property...

 

[RhodeIslandRed]

The estimated value of all US residential real estate peaked in 2006 at just about 25 trillion dollars. That is now down about 25%, but that still leaves it at 18 trillion dollars - and that is just residential property...

Oh well, at least I was in the right magnitude.

 

[markenk]

Pick your poison:

Republicans - Spend our money in Iraq, a country with no democratic institutions or foundations on a pipe dream that "democracy" will be exported.

or

Democrats - Spend our money in our country where there might be a bit more hope of something coming our way.

The bottom line is that either are going to spend "our" money on their pet projects!

I see the point you are trying to make, except that under the Obama administration the money will still be spent on war on terror whether it be in Iraq or Afgan or anywhere else, while at the same time more money will be spent to increase the government size.

 

[bamacon]

What happened to the 1,000 dollar check that was supposed to be in the mail if BHO was elected? When folks who were expecting to get paid for their vote don't get it they are going to be peeved. I think this bill will be such an utter catastrophe that the Dems will lose the House in 2010 and Obama will be a one termer. Then again, I thought there was no way America would elect a true socialist bordering on Marxist with virtually no experience and extremists for close advisors and friends. I think the plan is staggered to hand out big wads of cash right before each election cycle in hopes to buy votes. I guess we will have to wait and see but I'm betting they know the bill won't help the economy so they will try for National Health Care and Ending the troop presence in Iraq to secure victories in 2010 and reelection for Barry in 2012.

 

[Pluck and Grit]

Spend our money in Iraq, a country with no democratic institutions or foundations on a pipe dream that "democracy" will be exported.

Your assertions about Iraq's lack of democratic institutions or foundations are patently false. As for the pipe dream, it is less so every day. You should try to do a better job of keeping up with developments over there before you opine about them.

 

[Ldlane]

Your assertions about Iraq's lack of democratic institutions or foundations are patently false. As for the pipe dream, it is less so every day. You should try to do a better job of keeping up with developments over there before you opine about them.

I'm your "Huckleberry"! Fill me in on the "Democratic Ideals and Foundations" that Iraq was founded upon!

I think this Article from the Cato Inst. sums it up!

The long-term survival of democratic institutions requires a particular political culture that solidly supports democracy. The following cultural factors play an essential, collective role in stimulating and reinforcing a stable democratic political system:

* Political trust, i.e., the assumption that one's opponent will accept the rules of the democratic process and surrender power if he loses an election;
* Social tolerance, i.e., the acceptance of unpopular groups (e.g., homosexuals);
* Economic development (a high standard of living legitimizes both democratic institutions and incumbent politicians);
* Popular support for gender equality; and a
* High priority on freedom of speech and popular participation in decision-making.

According to Inglehart, among Islamic societies, levels of trust, tolerance, economic well-being, gender equality, and the priority given to political activism fall far short of what is found in all established democracies.

A Democratic Iraq? Don't Hold Your Breath

The data doesn't support it!

 

[Bamaro]

Until the electorate stops basing their votes primarily on the greed motive, we will continue to get policies like this 'stimulus' package.

 

[Pluck and Grit]

Ldlane, it's not my intention to pick any fights with you here when I make statements like "that is patently false." Just so you know.

And there are a lot of smart people at the Cato Institute.

But it's maddening how, 3 or 4 years ago, so many people made up their minds that the whole thing was a failure, and to them, that case was closed. More recent developments in the last year or so, especially in the last month or two, have provided a great deal of cause for hope.

I'm not some clown who has been harping all along about how wonderfully things have been going in Iraq, and how the press was ignoring it. 2005, 2006, and most of 2007 frankly sucked, and I was on the fence as to whether or not there was any hope for the future. However, I never saw withdrawal as a good or valid option.

There's plenty of information out there about what has happened as a result of the recent elections in Iraq. The hardline mullahs, Sadrists, and extremists have been voted out. The secular and moderate political parties are now rising to power. Violence has ebbed to such a level that it can't even be called a war anymore, whereas in early '06 it was looking like full blown civil war. The positive developments are there for all to see, but the US press has other concerns to feature right now. If Iraq does go to doo doo again, you can be sure they'll refocus on it.

The biggest thing is that we are developing a democratic ally right in the heart of the ME. What the Cato Institute says doesn't trump the reality of the situation.

 

[jthomas666]

But it's maddening how, 3 or 4 years ago, so many people made up their minds that the whole thing was a failure, and to them, that case was closed.

Kind of like the people trashing the stimulus package?

 

[NYBamaFan]

Until the electorate stops basing their votes primarily on the greed motive, we will continue to get policies like this 'stimulus' package.

Agreed, but this means that we are doomed...

 

[NYBamaFan]

Kind of like the people trashing the stimulus package?

Do you support it? You should know that it is huge. I have tried to pull it down from the internet a few times to read it. Too big. And the congressmen and senators that voted for it didn't read it, either. They only know what they put in it. In other words, they all voted for it because they all got something in it...

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

Why are we bailing out banks who are the federal reserve and control our money supply? The US government has no control over the federal reserve and is beholden to them for the additional debt they created to "bail" them out.

The beauty of the bailouts is they gave trillions of dollars to the bank by borrowing from the banks they gave it to and created additional interest that the taxpayers have to now pay those banks for money given to them.

Its pathetic. Where's Andrew Jackson when we need him?

 

[jthomas666]

You should know that it is huge.

It is? Really? I had no idea!! I figured Obama would dash it off on the back of a cocktail napkin--thanks for the info!! _eyes:

 

[NYBamaFan]

It is? Really? I had no idea!! I figured Obama would dash it off on the back of a cocktail napkin--thanks for the info!! _eyes:

If you have not read it, you have no idea, but stick with the sarcasm. It is far more effective than actual debate.