Can the corrupting influence of money in politics ever be brought under control?

Bamaro

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Probably not without a constitutional amendment (which I support) or you could fly a gyrocopter onto the Capitol grounds (which I give a thumbs up to also).
 

twofbyc

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Probably not without a constitutional amendment (which I support) or you could fly a gyrocopter onto the Capitol grounds (which I give a thumbs up to also).
Actually this guy was pushing our agenda - although not a member of any chapter that I'm aware of, some of his FB posts or tweets referred to us by name, I believe.

And a constitutional amendment will never happen, that's why we are going this route. ERA still hasn't been ratified. But we are getting national attention; it's no coincidence that someone in Congress just introduced legislation to address this issue (it will go nowhere, that's why we're active) and even HC said we should have constitutional amendment.
 
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crimsonaudio

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I honestly wonder if it's ever been 'under control'. You can search throughout history (not just US history) and find examples over and over again of political offices being compromised by money.

Some long for the halcyon days when the USA was still young and idealistic, but I question whether it was ever much better than it is today. Finances corrupting power was certainly more subtle than today (where it's often done in plain sight), but I doubt it was very much different even 200 years ago...

IOW, I think financial corruption will always be in politics - truly incorruptible people seem to be uncommon, and those that truly live ethically and morally rarely seem to drawn to run for office.

Not a cynicist, just a realist.
 
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Bamaro

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I honestly wonder if it's ever been 'under control'. You can search throughout history (not just US history) and find examples over and over again of political offices being compromised by money.

Some long for the halcyon days when the USA was still young and idealistic, but I question whether it was ever much better than it is today. Finances corrupting power was certainly more subtle than today (where it's often done in plain sight), but I doubt it was very much different even 200 years ago...
Its always been done its just that it is so much more rampant today, especially after the Citizens United decision.
 

Mamacalled

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I don't see it ever happening. Too much money from corporations, unions, environmental groups etc. Neither side wants to give up the money.
 

Tide1986

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As long as the federal government has as much control over us as it currently does, laws like these are merely placebos. A root cause analysis would suggest that we need to shrink dramatically the involvement of the federal government in our lives.
 

TIDE-HSV

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As long as the federal government has as much control over us as it currently does, laws like these are merely placebos. A root cause analysis would suggest that we need to shrink dramatically the involvement of the federal government in our lives.
I equate absolutely big government and big industry/commerce/banking. There's no difference in the roles they play in our lives. I've suggested reading "Folklore of Capitalism" by a former CCA2 justice and assistant US Attorney General for Antitrust. Offbeat views like that of mine which don't easily fit into a cubbyhole are the reason I never, ever try to explain my politics around here...
 

twofbyc

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Yes. Corporations = humans did it and $$$ = speech. That was a game changer...
And that's what we're trying to do - and have already done in Tallahassee: limit campaign contributions. SCOTUS left that door wide open, we're trying to prop it open and get through it before it gets closed.
What we have now that we have really never had before in our history is legalized bribery. It's still wrong; we just want to make it illegal like it should be. And our organization is cross-partisan; locally, we have tea party, dems and repubs and are getting close to adding at least one libertarian.
BTW, all measures that have passed to this point (both binding and non binding) have passed with massive majorities - in the 80% range. Even in Tallahassee, the vote was 67% - 23%. It can be done.
 

Bodhisattva

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Government is inherently corrupt (among other things). The bigger the government the bigger the corruption.

To counter this, we once limited federal government to what was expressly allowed (enumerated powers) in the Constitution.

Now, the interpretation is that the federal government can do whatever is not expressly prohibited in the Constitution.

The big government crowd had us jump the shark long ago.
 

selmaborntidefan

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This question is almost (no offense intended) absurd. The government appropriates money for things, and the way to keep them happy is to.....give them money.


There never was any "idealistic" time when we had pristine politics or that the Republicans and Democrats (or any of the parties in our history) ever got along like two scoops of ice cream. Furthermore, how do you get a politician who has thrived in one set-up to be willing to abandon that set-up in the name of cleaning things up? Money used to buy votes at places like Tammany Hall and Chicago - ironically, one of the plusses of the development of the New Deal welfare system was that it took power to fix elections out of the hands of local bosses with the consequence of people now voting in whoever they feel will protect their money (which is sort of the same thing we're talking about with the donations here).

Corruption and power by money has always been even here in the good ole USA. Simply go look up some names like James Blaine, Mark Hanna, Maurice Stans, Ron Brown, Paul Tully, and others. Offices were bought and paid for by the railroad industry in the 19th century and the "Chicago miracles" of the Daley regime are legendary. Texas oil money, too.

It is what it is, and it isn't changing. And the simple fact is that if you're rich you can get a seat at the table (not all that different from moving to the front of the Tide Pride line, ha ha). Two things I've always found amusing are the GOP candidates who rant "against government" but then want a job in government and the Democratic ones who will scream hysterical about "the rich" and money and "the system" but yet take that system's money and actually try to persuade people they're "for" the "common man," who gave them nothing.

But I side with George Carlin here - if the problem is REALLY the politicians then WHERE are all of the great people of conscience? As he notes, these pols don't fall out of the sky from another universe, they're part of our daily lives.
 

twofbyc

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Obviously your group gets too much money and needs to be limited. Server time is just a different kind of money. I halfway kid, but halfway not if your logic is to be applied.
Not sure I follow...? Locally, we get no money - we don't accept any monetary contributions. Nationally, they do accept donations.
Server time...?
Our beef is that we want our elected officials (elected with our votes, whose "salaries" are paid by us) to represent the people who vote for them - and we want that to eventually also be the people who fund their campaigns. You can call it "pie in the sky" or whatever, but it can be done despite what some on here say. It WON'T happen if too many people insist it can't be done and do nothing to make it happen - "can't" never "could".
 

Tidewater

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We're trying...in the link, look at all of the different parts of the country now on board.
Granted, the South is thin and we dropped the ball by postponing our event yesterday, but the movement is picking up steam.
www.represent.us
https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/repday15?source=feed_text&story_id=1092785117402025#repday15
That appears to be a proposed act of Congress. The cabal of Congress, President, Federal judges will get to interpret that act and they will do so in such a way as to make the law meaningless.
Checks and balances no longer work to limit the power and scope of the Federal government, the three branches work together to limit the citizens.

I would suggest a constitutional amendment of one term for each elected Federal office (Rep, Senator, VP & Pres) for life, with a minimum of five year between terms.
No re-eligility, no need for re-election funds.
 

Tide1986

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That appears to be a proposed act of Congress. The cabal of Congress, President, Federal judges will get to interpret that act and they will do so in such a way as to make the law meaningless. Checks and balances no longer work to limit the power and scope of the Federal government, the three branches work together to limit the citizens.
QFT

I would suggest a constitutional amendment of one term for each elected Federal office (Rep, Senator, VP & Pres) for life, with a minimum of five year between terms.
No re-eligility, no need for re-election funds.
In this scenario, would the terms remain the same? Or would longer terms be appropriate (e.g. Rep 4 yrs, Senator 8 yrs, VP & Pres 6 yrs)?
 

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