Andre Smith: Combine/Decisions/Future
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Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
I heard an interview on ESPN Sports Radio the other night with one of their NFL wanks, (don't remember his name) he said that Andre measured 6'4", but his armspan was the equivalent of a guy 6'8".
I heard an interview on ESPN Sports Radio the other night with one of their NFL wanks, (don't remember his name) he said that Andre measured 6'4", but his armspan was the equivalent of a guy 6'8".
Re: Financial Implications of Andre's Bad Weekend
I just don't want to see him pull a Dante Ellington.
_frown:
I just don't want to see him pull a Dante Ellington.
_frown:
Re: Financial Implications of Andre's Bad Weekend
This is hardly the time for 'Dre to take "time off." If in fact he is, taking time off right now could be absolutely the worst time.
What if he has a career-ending injury in mini-camp? There are no guarantees.
This is hardly the time for 'Dre to take "time off." If in fact he is, taking time off right now could be absolutely the worst time.
What if he has a career-ending injury in mini-camp? There are no guarantees.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
it's more than bad info...the kid has never had to work at this, and now that he's having to, it's a bit of a struggle for him. No, he probably hasn't been given the best advice, but this 'football thing' has always come so naturally to him and he's never worked hard enough to realize his full potential. That attitude won't cut it in the NFL and he's finding that out right now. It's an expensive lesson he's learning.
it's more than bad info...the kid has never had to work at this, and now that he's having to, it's a bit of a struggle for him. No, he probably hasn't been given the best advice, but this 'football thing' has always come so naturally to him and he's never worked hard enough to realize his full potential. That attitude won't cut it in the NFL and he's finding that out right now. It's an expensive lesson he's learning.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Hope this can bring some clarity to the situation. There are two problems in Andre's life right now. One... the people surrounding him. Two, decline in his reputation. If you have paid close attention to Andre's bio the past three years, you have realized that he isn't the most driven person. Likely the main reason for that is the fact he is so naturally gifted. While most of the incoming HS players have to start playing with grit/determination each play when they hit college, Andre has always had the luxury of "turning the switch on" when he wanted to and then dominate the guy in front of him. Realize, however, that's not necessarily something that can't be overcome... it happens in the draft every year and guys consistently find the challenge in the league that they needed.
However, knowing what to say and when to say it is important to NFL folks. IF there's a lesser talented guy on the board than Andre who says/does the right thing consistently, an NFL team will often take that guy because they perceive lesser problems in the future.
IMO (note this is just my opinion), everything that is hurting Andre TODAY began when the agent entered the picture... and people began hanging around him for the scraps that would come their way. If it's me advising... I tell him to fire his agent and loose some of the company that obviously is not helping him do/say the right things at this point. Many a good kid like Andre has lost money/opportunities because of this very thing - and he better wake up and realize what their presence is costing him at this point.
Hope this can bring some clarity to the situation. There are two problems in Andre's life right now. One... the people surrounding him. Two, decline in his reputation. If you have paid close attention to Andre's bio the past three years, you have realized that he isn't the most driven person. Likely the main reason for that is the fact he is so naturally gifted. While most of the incoming HS players have to start playing with grit/determination each play when they hit college, Andre has always had the luxury of "turning the switch on" when he wanted to and then dominate the guy in front of him. Realize, however, that's not necessarily something that can't be overcome... it happens in the draft every year and guys consistently find the challenge in the league that they needed.
However, knowing what to say and when to say it is important to NFL folks. IF there's a lesser talented guy on the board than Andre who says/does the right thing consistently, an NFL team will often take that guy because they perceive lesser problems in the future.
IMO (note this is just my opinion), everything that is hurting Andre TODAY began when the agent entered the picture... and people began hanging around him for the scraps that would come their way. If it's me advising... I tell him to fire his agent and loose some of the company that obviously is not helping him do/say the right things at this point. Many a good kid like Andre has lost money/opportunities because of this very thing - and he better wake up and realize what their presence is costing him at this point.
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Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
File under: Kierkegaardian despair
I can't help but wonder if the way it's playing out might actually be the best chance for Andre Smith to be a better player.
If the issues raised recently are as speculated, his being drafted 1st overall would do nothing to change them. If anything, the nonchalance would be reinforced.
Some here ought to understand that it is not unusual for gifted or talented kids to develop a certain nonchalance not necessarily because they are lazy, but as protection. The message that can get sent is that any successes are due to your gifts, which were handed to you, while any failures are a mark of personal inadequacy. Attempts to "tough love" these kids into raising it a level are destined to fail, because what they need is not motivation but some basic emotional reassurance that everyone will not turn on them if it turns out that they don't meet every (unrealistic) expectation that everyone (and they themselves, often) has of them. Ultimately, it's about a secure sense of identity. The message they get from the "tough love" is that they can be abandoned, when what they need is to know that there are people they can trust to be there no matter what happens.
People wonder why kids like this won't invest more, and they will even resent them, thinking that if they had those gifts they would work so much harder. It's a distorted picture, but it isn't hard for kids in this situation to feel like they are in a lose-lose situation, in which whatever they do threatens to isolate them.
Obviously, I've got to wonder if Andre Smith doesn't have some of this going on. In which case, being drafted very high and viewed as the savior of a lousy team is probably the worst thing that could happen to him. I would dare say that he would be destined to disappoint in that case.
On the other case, a slide has some potential to allow Andre to see some of all this for what it is. Having not met expectations, he may finally have to decide to become what he wants, rather than just keep doing whatever the next thing laid before him is. If he decides he loves being an nfl LT, he'll get paid, because the talent is such that he can be. And if he decides he wants to be something else, then I hope he has the guts to do it and love doing it.
Then again, mid-round nfl money is still more than most ever see, so it's entirely possible that he slugs along in mediocrity for 3 or 5 or 7 years, still feels like he gets to take care of people, and doesn't have to risk anything.
There's no timeline for epiphany. One day you just wake up and see things differently. Often it's something you knew for a long time. At the end of the day it's something he has to get ahold of himself and no one can do it for him.
I don't see a whole lot of people showing a lot of concern for Andre Smith the person, and I'm guessing that his whole thing right now is that he needs to somehow know that Andre Smith the person is going to be ok whether or not he's a football player. Although it might in some ways seem counterintuitive, his best chance at being a great and happy football player might be to get some more people around him who don't care if he's a football player.
Unfortunately, I don't get the sense that there are a lot of people around him who are putting him in a position to succeed.
Re: the first line
In Sickness Unto Death Soren Kierkegaard talks about something that has since been called "Kierkegaardian dispair." It's an existential crisis in which on realizes that there are any number of potential things one could become, but to choose any one means sacrificing others. The catch is that realizing any potential requires this leap of faith. But particularly for those who've had the limitlessness of their potential reinforced to the point where this limitlessness itself comes to be identified as part of their identity, it can be wrenching to get past this.
File under: Kierkegaardian despair
I can't help but wonder if the way it's playing out might actually be the best chance for Andre Smith to be a better player.
If the issues raised recently are as speculated, his being drafted 1st overall would do nothing to change them. If anything, the nonchalance would be reinforced.
Some here ought to understand that it is not unusual for gifted or talented kids to develop a certain nonchalance not necessarily because they are lazy, but as protection. The message that can get sent is that any successes are due to your gifts, which were handed to you, while any failures are a mark of personal inadequacy. Attempts to "tough love" these kids into raising it a level are destined to fail, because what they need is not motivation but some basic emotional reassurance that everyone will not turn on them if it turns out that they don't meet every (unrealistic) expectation that everyone (and they themselves, often) has of them. Ultimately, it's about a secure sense of identity. The message they get from the "tough love" is that they can be abandoned, when what they need is to know that there are people they can trust to be there no matter what happens.
People wonder why kids like this won't invest more, and they will even resent them, thinking that if they had those gifts they would work so much harder. It's a distorted picture, but it isn't hard for kids in this situation to feel like they are in a lose-lose situation, in which whatever they do threatens to isolate them.
Obviously, I've got to wonder if Andre Smith doesn't have some of this going on. In which case, being drafted very high and viewed as the savior of a lousy team is probably the worst thing that could happen to him. I would dare say that he would be destined to disappoint in that case.
On the other case, a slide has some potential to allow Andre to see some of all this for what it is. Having not met expectations, he may finally have to decide to become what he wants, rather than just keep doing whatever the next thing laid before him is. If he decides he loves being an nfl LT, he'll get paid, because the talent is such that he can be. And if he decides he wants to be something else, then I hope he has the guts to do it and love doing it.
Then again, mid-round nfl money is still more than most ever see, so it's entirely possible that he slugs along in mediocrity for 3 or 5 or 7 years, still feels like he gets to take care of people, and doesn't have to risk anything.
There's no timeline for epiphany. One day you just wake up and see things differently. Often it's something you knew for a long time. At the end of the day it's something he has to get ahold of himself and no one can do it for him.
I don't see a whole lot of people showing a lot of concern for Andre Smith the person, and I'm guessing that his whole thing right now is that he needs to somehow know that Andre Smith the person is going to be ok whether or not he's a football player. Although it might in some ways seem counterintuitive, his best chance at being a great and happy football player might be to get some more people around him who don't care if he's a football player.
Unfortunately, I don't get the sense that there are a lot of people around him who are putting him in a position to succeed.
Re: the first line
In Sickness Unto Death Soren Kierkegaard talks about something that has since been called "Kierkegaardian dispair." It's an existential crisis in which on realizes that there are any number of potential things one could become, but to choose any one means sacrificing others. The catch is that realizing any potential requires this leap of faith. But particularly for those who've had the limitlessness of their potential reinforced to the point where this limitlessness itself comes to be identified as part of their identity, it can be wrenching to get past this.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Even with all the jib jab about dre...he still goes in the 1st round. This crap is just filler to give these guys something to talk about.
Even with all the jib jab about dre...he still goes in the 1st round. This crap is just filler to give these guys something to talk about.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
I think you are right about him still going in the first round, but this is MAJOR, MAJOR for Andre. There is a huge difference between going in the top 5 where it seemed he was a certainty to be drafted and going middle to late in the first round.
There is no doubt Andre has cost himself millions of dollars, the question is how any million?
:conf2:
I think you are right about him still going in the first round, but this is MAJOR, MAJOR for Andre. There is a huge difference between going in the top 5 where it seemed he was a certainty to be drafted and going middle to late in the first round.
There is no doubt Andre has cost himself millions of dollars, the question is how any million?
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Kudos. The closest parallel I can think of is the guy who easily made good grades throughout the primary and secondary educational systems, only to be awakened in college to the reality that he, too, might have to work at this thing. I was that guy, and my epiphany wasn't immediate. I find your post very interesting--in retrospect, finding friends who didn't care one way or the other about academia actually did help me regain my interest in higher learning. Andre won't have the luxury of time, though. Hopefully, he responds quickly.
Kudos. The closest parallel I can think of is the guy who easily made good grades throughout the primary and secondary educational systems, only to be awakened in college to the reality that he, too, might have to work at this thing. I was that guy, and my epiphany wasn't immediate. I find your post very interesting--in retrospect, finding friends who didn't care one way or the other about academia actually did help me regain my interest in higher learning. Andre won't have the luxury of time, though. Hopefully, he responds quickly.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
I really feel sorry for him. Before you flame me, I think the agent issue is at the root of the problem. The agent caught Andre like a fish, and now feels no responsibility for him. I know the ultimate responsibility is with the player, but c'mon, the agents get good money to help these guys along-ie make sure they stay in shape after the season ends, getting them to dress correctly when they go job hunting, etc...
I don't think Andre realizes this..otherwise he would be looking for a new agent to guide him down the path.
I really feel sorry for him. Before you flame me, I think the agent issue is at the root of the problem. The agent caught Andre like a fish, and now feels no responsibility for him. I know the ultimate responsibility is with the player, but c'mon, the agents get good money to help these guys along-ie make sure they stay in shape after the season ends, getting them to dress correctly when they go job hunting, etc...
I don't think Andre realizes this..otherwise he would be looking for a new agent to guide him down the path.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Well then this is one of the worst agents in the world. If you give advice that costs your player money then you cost yourself money. Personally, I think Andre is going to ultimately correct this and have a good pro day in T-Town. We will see but something tells me he is seeing the writing on the wall so to speak with all this attention.
Well then this is one of the worst agents in the world. If you give advice that costs your player money then you cost yourself money. Personally, I think Andre is going to ultimately correct this and have a good pro day in T-Town. We will see but something tells me he is seeing the writing on the wall so to speak with all this attention.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
I think it depends on the coach and the relationship they have with the player. From CNS's statements in the past he seems to be very forthwright with his players in giving his honest opinion to them concerning their future. I would certainly think, if asked, he would give his opinion on the agent stuff, the interview process etc. That said, if you have a falling out between the coach and player then who knows. Do you think Mark Sanchez is going to ask Pete Carroll his opinion?
I think it depends on the coach and the relationship they have with the player. From CNS's statements in the past he seems to be very forthwright with his players in giving his honest opinion to them concerning their future. I would certainly think, if asked, he would give his opinion on the agent stuff, the interview process etc. That said, if you have a falling out between the coach and player then who knows. Do you think Mark Sanchez is going to ask Pete Carroll his opinion?
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
I don't know why so many of you are assuming that he is getting "bad info" or "bad advice" from someone. If he played for UT or Auburn he would be a sorry, lazy, classles bum...right? Maybe he is getting bad advice. But I wish for once we would not blame someone else for bad choices made by a Bama player.
The beatdown continues
I don't know why so many of you are assuming that he is getting "bad info" or "bad advice" from someone. If he played for UT or Auburn he would be a sorry, lazy, classles bum...right? Maybe he is getting bad advice. But I wish for once we would not blame someone else for bad choices made by a Bama player.
The beatdown continues
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Huh?
You mean they don't have anything else to talk about besides Andre Smith? Or is it just another big media-based conspiracy against Alabama?
Look, bottom line is Pro Day is in just about two weeks. Smith needs to magically and almost instantaneously get in NFL shape in that very short span, or he will forever be the lead cautionary tale that "good" agents beat into the heads of their young clients.
Huh?
You mean they don't have anything else to talk about besides Andre Smith? Or is it just another big media-based conspiracy against Alabama?
Look, bottom line is Pro Day is in just about two weeks. Smith needs to magically and almost instantaneously get in NFL shape in that very short span, or he will forever be the lead cautionary tale that "good" agents beat into the heads of their young clients.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Can't speak for the past or for everyone's "classifications", but there is a fact for kids in his situation right now that goes as follows... "listen to the people around you and follow their advice." That's what an agent is there for... he's been there before, knows the right/wrong things to do/say, etc. Any agent worth his salt doesn't let his client say/do certain things. And, when a player does/says those types of things, the best route is to assume the agent either gave bad advice or didn't give any whatsoever. Don't care if the kid is Bama's or not, that's the first place to look for immediate blame.
Can't speak for the past or for everyone's "classifications", but there is a fact for kids in his situation right now that goes as follows... "listen to the people around you and follow their advice." That's what an agent is there for... he's been there before, knows the right/wrong things to do/say, etc. Any agent worth his salt doesn't let his client say/do certain things. And, when a player does/says those types of things, the best route is to assume the agent either gave bad advice or didn't give any whatsoever. Don't care if the kid is Bama's or not, that's the first place to look for immediate blame.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Exactly; In theory that is what the agent is paid to do. Take responsibility for the kids future.
So, assuming that the agent did what he was paid to do; Andre listened to his advice and acted the way he was told to act. In which case it was not only terrible advice but Andre turned a blind eye to what, even the average fan knows, is improper conduct.
Or he ignored his agents advice, which is even more baffling since he is paying dearly for this advice.
Either way he will be a good player at the next level and he needs to mend some fences. Hopefully, someone will give him good advice as to how this can best be done.
:BigA: RTR!
Exactly; In theory that is what the agent is paid to do. Take responsibility for the kids future.
So, assuming that the agent did what he was paid to do; Andre listened to his advice and acted the way he was told to act. In which case it was not only terrible advice but Andre turned a blind eye to what, even the average fan knows, is improper conduct.
Or he ignored his agents advice, which is even more baffling since he is paying dearly for this advice.
Either way he will be a good player at the next level and he needs to mend some fences. Hopefully, someone will give him good advice as to how this can best be done.
:BigA: RTR!
Re: Financial Implications of Andre's Bad Weekend
Andre is an exceptional athlete, probably the second best OL ever to play at Alabama and I hope he continues this at the next level BUT, Andre wasn't made a team leader of Bama for a reason. He had to be led to the scales each week to make sure he kept his weight down, that's not a leader. I'm disappointed in him for his attitude lately and at the same time I 'm still proud of him for the way he played for us at Alabama.
He's gone now and is a total adult with no one to look after him but veteran teammates and an agent who is mostly looking out for his own pocket. At least his "agent" should be looking out for his own pocket. Right now it sounds like the blind leading the blind. I hope for the best for Andre and maybe this will be a wake up call for him.
Andre is an exceptional athlete, probably the second best OL ever to play at Alabama and I hope he continues this at the next level BUT, Andre wasn't made a team leader of Bama for a reason. He had to be led to the scales each week to make sure he kept his weight down, that's not a leader. I'm disappointed in him for his attitude lately and at the same time I 'm still proud of him for the way he played for us at Alabama.
He's gone now and is a total adult with no one to look after him but veteran teammates and an agent who is mostly looking out for his own pocket. At least his "agent" should be looking out for his own pocket. Right now it sounds like the blind leading the blind. I hope for the best for Andre and maybe this will be a wake up call for him.
Re: McShay is a fool [About Andre Smith]
Well, an agent would be a fool to advise a player to do what Andre has done. This move has cost Andre millions of dollars. And the more Andre loses, the more the agent loses.
Well, an agent would be a fool to advise a player to do what Andre has done. This move has cost Andre millions of dollars. And the more Andre loses, the more the agent loses.
Re: Financial Implications of Andre's Bad Weekend
I think he's got some kind of injury. That's why he didn't participate in the combine, and it may even go back to before the bowl, which would help explain the alleged insurance policy.
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I think he's got some kind of injury. That's why he didn't participate in the combine, and it may even go back to before the bowl, which would help explain the alleged insurance policy.
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