Stars in our eyes...

[TIDE-HSV]

These stats courtesy of "Baneret" on TI's Closed Forum - a good solid poster - these stix are public domain. On the SEC All-Frosh team, only one 5* player, Doucet of LSU. Seven 4*and twelve 3*. Two were unranked and eight of the twenty-seven were not in the top 100. Just some numbers to make one go "Hmm."

 

[HammerJammer]

could some of that be that the teams that get the 5 star players are generally the top teams and therefore it's harder for those 5 star players to get playing time as a freshman. example, would it be more likely for a 3 star player at Miss St or a 5 star player at georgia to be a starter? look at croyle, he was the number 1 Qb recruit in the nation but played very little his freshman year. does that mean he's not 5 star caliber? i'm not saying that the stars are valid, just playing devil's advocate. or should i say, playing vol's advocate.

 

[ihatefulmer]

The thing i like to look at is who else is recruiting the player,not how many stars. You might see a 2 * but Florida,Ga.,LSU and UT are recruiting him. To me that really show what type of talent the player is, the schools that are after him not the recruiting "experts". These coaches, who determine who to offer to, better know who can play and who can't. If they're wrong they might be looking for another job next year. The "experts" can offered to have a bad year the coaches can't.

 

[drjamesm]

Ihatefulmer

I have been following recruiting many moons and I must say I can tell you one thing the star system can be subjective,but as you said the best way to measure a recruit is by whom is offering. Therefore, this is what I understand most D1 schools study film and eval camps and actually personally scout most of their recruits before they offer....so these guys lose their jobs over Wins or losses and recruit accordingly. I know some of our more crimsom glasses wearers talk of W G. from last year,but he is the exception not the rule b/c Saunders and some db from Anniston from the year before were like him and how has that worked out! Also, WG was just not hyped and fell through the cracks until the HS All star game where he was unblockable and guess what the barn tried to sign him so........Yes the barn has become very smug in thier attitude toward whom they offer so the theory by many of our posters seem to believe needs to get in line with yours.
drjamesm

 

[TexasBama]

It would be interesting to see what the All-SEC (not ALL-SEC frosh) team looked like star-wise. Your numbers show that a 2* player is not likely to make All-SEC Frosh.

 

[bamabake]

I have been following recruiting many moons and I must say I can tell you one thing the star system can be subjective,but as you said the best way to measure a recruit is by whom is offering. Therefore, this is what I understand most D1 schools study film and eval camps and actually personally scout most of their recruits before they offer....so these guys lose their jobs over Wins or losses and recruit accordingly. I know some of our more crimsom glasses wearers talk of W G. from last year,but he is the exception not the rule b/c Saunders and some db from Anniston from the year before were like him and how has that worked out! Also, WG was just not hyped and fell through the cracks until the HS All star game where he was unblockable and guess what the barn tried to sign him so........Yes the barn has become very smug in thier attitude toward whom they offer so the theory by many of our posters seem to believe needs to get in line with yours.
drjamesm

It would seem that the "if by who is offering" is the standard, are we saying then that they have peeps on their staff that can better analyze talent?

 

[RollTide2432]

People can argue this until they are blue in the face. Basically my theory is enjoy following it but nobody will know anything about how successful a recruit is until 2 years anyways. With that being said I hope Alabama gets as many 5 stars as possible even though most people on here think a 3 star will be better.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

Evaluations are very subjective...

Different staffs - and staff members within staffs - feel differently about players. I liked Tom Lemming's (who does it for a living) remark that the difference between a #1 and a #20 team can be as small as two players. One thing's for sure - if you recruit a bunch of OL, and to some degree DL, your class rating will always be lower than if you loaded up on skill players - no matter that OL is what you needed for a super team. The surest way to win the "recruiting war" would be to recruit all QBs...

 

[drjamesm]

Bama Bake

What I'm saying is that the coaches jobs live or die by W's and L's. I'm not saying some staffs recruit and eval talent better than our's. I'm saying if a prospect is recruited by many big programs then many different coaches think this kid has potential. Potential means only that he could be a good or great player,some have poor work ethic or do not work out as a student.(exceptions are Ucheat,UF,Ark and Miami where they only go to class if they feel like it)However,if 5 or more big schools offer a kid he must have POTENTIAL to be good and this is never a sure thing!
drjamesm

 

[ihatefulmer]

Different staffs - and staff members within staffs - feel differently about players. I liked Tom Lemming's (who does it for a living) remark that the difference between a #1 and a #20 team can be as small as two players. One thing's for sure - if you recruit a bunch of OL, and to some degree DL, your class rating will always be lower than if you loaded up on skill players - no matter that OL is what you needed for a super team. The surest way to win the "recruiting war" would be to recruit all QBs...

Maybe next year we will sign 25 QB's and be ranked #1. LOL.

I've kind of thought,and would like to know your opinon, if you took away the skilled players (QB, RB & WR) were this class ,that we got so far, might rank?
I'm thinking top 5 or so. We are getting what we need for sure.

 

[Crimson Surfer]

People can argue this until they are blue in the face. Basically my theory is enjoy following it but nobody will know anything about how successful a recruit is until 2 years anyways. With that being said I hope Alabama gets as many 5 stars as possible even though most people on here think a 3 star will be better.

I will give you one thing you are persistent in arguing your position about the star system.

You may be very disappointed because Bama may not get very many if any 5 star recruits on NSD. For the record I don't think anyone here thinks a 3 star recruit is better than a 5 star. Unlike you though some of us may be open to the fact that the contrary may not necessarily be true in all cases either.

Just so you can feel better about Bama's lack of 5 star commitments, I will tell you that Mike Shula was not a 5 star recruit and he was an multiple 1st team All-SEC QB at Bama. Jay Barker was not a 5 star recruit and he was a National Championship QB, National award winner and Heisman contender for Bama. Chris Samuels possibly the best offensive lineman but for sure one of the best to ever play at Alabama was rated very low with only a few stars when he came out of High School.

 

[JessN]

I've tried to explain how stars are doled out before, and it falls on deaf ears. Here's a quick redirect, particularly on QB Jimmy Barnes. He just got his star rating elevated from a 3-star to a 4-star on one service, because they finally got around to seeing him in person less than a month ago. But that didn't stop Barnes from getting tagged a "3-star" for months, which is what most people remember. I don't find it fair.

When I was doing NARCAS rankings every year, I didn't assign rankings until late January. But where's the fun in that, if you're a recruiting junkie?

If you won't take it from me, take it from someone else. Here's an ESPN column from this week that sheds some interesting light on high-star guys vs. sleepers in the 2001 recruiting class:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=feldman_bruce&id=1942440

 

[RollTide2432]

I just think stars are irrelavant, but to assume a 3 star player is going to be great just because Alabama recruited them is silly in my opinion. We will have to wait and see like every other school in the ocuntry.

 

[rtrcam]

Furthermore, I wonder what the star ratings of the players in the NFL were?

Think about where some of the starting qbs in the NFL played in college. One that comes to mind is Pittsburgh's qb, who played at Miami (OH) from the Mid American Conference.

Jerry Rice played at Mississippi Valley State. Walter Payton played at a D-2A school.

Certainly a lot of players were highly recruited 5 stars who played at major colleges and went on to success in the NFL. But a lot of them weren't even recruited by the big schools.