UA Academic Achievements

CapstoneGrad06

Hall of Fame
Jan 19, 2006
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Houston, Texas
I came to Alabama in the fall of 2001 and I have witnessed a lot of change in the short five years I have been here. Most of these changes have occurred since Dr. Witt came on board. I fully support Dr Witt and his goals to improve the image of the University. It's about time we increased enrollement to mirror the other large schools in the SEC. This brings in more money to the University and it helps the economy of Tuscaloosa. I'm sure some will argue that the quality of education will go down with this process. I'm not so sure that this is entirely true. I have no concrete proof of this, but neither do the naysayers as Witt's expereiment is only three years old. However, I think bringing in more students and more money is a plus anytime. I'm sure the quality of students has declined on the bottom end of the academic totem pole, but this is the price to pay when adjusting enrollment so dramatically.

As the Flagship of the state we should give more Alabama high school students at least the opportunity to attend college, and by doing that we will have to let in marginal sutdents. Lets be honest here too, the state of Alabama is small in terms of population and educationally we rank near the bottom in the United States. With Witt's plan we'll get our quantity from Alabama, with quality too, and bring in bright students from around the country as well. This at least helps the state in terms of allowing some students, who may not otherwise attend college, make a better life for themselves and help the state of Alabama in the process. This may not be Witt's complete reason for doing this, but it certainly can seem that way.

I think Witt is doing a fine job in this process and he is making the University a wonderful place to attend. Sure tuition is rising, but that is happening all over the country. We have a vast amount of things available to us that other schools do not. Our facilities are constatnly being upgraded and new ones are being added. I am just proud to see the University growing and expanding its boundaries in academia. I am also proud to see a president of the University taking action and improving the University, as Sorenson seemed to do nothing, at least not at this level.

As some may know, the University has limitations some colleges in other regions don't have when trying to compete on a national level, instead of a regional (i.e. state population and overall high school education level). As the Flagship of the state, Alabama's people should want the best from their University. Alabama is trying to accomplish this and President Witt is leading the charge.

I know some of you may not appreciate my comments, but this is a subject I feel strongly about. I want the best for my school and the best for the great state of Alabama.
 

biglittlelittle

1st Team
Aug 14, 2005
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It's the offseason, so I don't feel too bad taking up these few kb's of space. My problem with this plan is not the money at all. I would hope that the admin would only undertake profitable projects. My point is I don't care about the profits. I care about the school and about the regular students concerns concerning this very issue. I don't care about competing with AU over enrollment size nor do I care about jumping 10 spots in the Princeton Review's rankings. I care about sustaining the things I love about the University for my kids, and to that, I think Witt is demolishing. I want that small school feel. I want my kids to have a relationship with their professors and for their teachers to be qualified and to be professors. Not saying all GTA's are bad, but having Professors is much better. I don't want tuition for anyone going up 18% a year. I want walking from class to class a reality. This one characteristics sets us apart from UGA and AU. I also like having my 10 oclock classes and none on Friday's. And I like having a computer in the computer lab to be available when I need one. This might all sound selfish but when its my money going towards these things I expect it, and these things are going away quickly as enrollment increases. Not to mention, trying to get from Hackberry to the ten Hoor parking lot taking 35 minutes and your car overheating on the way and you having to park on the Strip and running so you won't be late on the third day of class.

Also in the presentation, there was no mention of where new academic facilities were going to be built. Maybe I missed something, but they will have to be built away from the "core" of campus similar to Shelby Hall. i guess Shelby Hall is another issue altogether.
 

CapstoneGrad06

Hall of Fame
Jan 19, 2006
7,105
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Houston, Texas
I think this can boil down to one thing over this issue. At Alabama we always strive for the best and sometimes to go to great lenghts to do it. Sure I love a small school atmosphere, but I also love being a prt of something bigger than me. I want my school to be known across the nation, both for its academic accolades and the things it makes available to its students.

This is to say, do we want progress, and sometimes that means making sacrafices, or do we want to stay the same. This is not about competing with AU or UGa. This is about competing with the country. Sure we'll never be Harvard or Yale, but can't we strive to be a Virginia or Michigan? I want the school and the city of Tuscaloosa to grow and grow, to provide all that we need as citizens and students. Its high time Alabama cam out of its shell and show the country what we are made of, both academically and athletically.
 

rkwilkerson

All-American
Feb 20, 2006
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Tuscaloosa, AL
fact is....

we aren't a small school, and we will never be small school...

3,000 to 5,000 is considered a small school, I transfered from one


Alabama is already at 21,000 and that is small by no means
 

biglittlelittle

1st Team
Aug 14, 2005
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I didn't say small school or shrink the school, I said small school "feel" which indicates small class sizes, a compact campus, and that 1 degree of separation from everyone you meet. You don't compete with Virginia or Michigan unless you provide a top tier education along with strict standards for entry. I think we definitely have above average education at the University of Alabama especialy from our Professors. But I think we do not make it to that top tier because of class sizes, and our standards for entry, and possibly the lack of difficulty in many of our 1st and 2nd year classes. A 2.5 GPA and an 18 ACT doesn't make it in those top state schools, nor would they survive the academic competition at those schools. This point of view was easily dismissed earlier whether you agree with it or not, because a state school should give everyone the opportunity of a college education. This idea has some merit but at high quality state institutions, this is not the case. If all you want is a college diploma, you should go to UNA, UAH JSU (Just Show Up)or elsewhere, (no offense to the people that go to those places, just on diploma and educational value alone) not the premier institutions in the state.

I'm not against progress either. I just think you should make improvements and be content with the size of the school. That is the size that the infrastructure can maintain. And with the current two lane roads, number of classrooms, a few more students is about all the University can hold. Age the wine, instead of making more wine. Unless we turn University, Hackberry, Campus Dr. and Paul W Bryant into 4 lane roads through campus, I don't see much hope in all of these increases in enrollment, without serious problems. And developing those roads in such a manner is not very plausible.
 

Braveheart

All-SEC
Feb 12, 2006
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Not saying it's right but

tuition is going up EVERYWHERE across the country, not just in Alabama. This is happening at both private and public colleges, far outpacing inflation. So, it's clearly not just a UA thing.
 

WRhodesTider

1st Team
Jul 25, 2001
506
0
135
Birmingham, Al
biglittlelittle said:
It's the offseason, so I don't feel too bad taking up these few kb's of space. My problem with this plan is not the money at all. I would hope that the admin would only undertake profitable projects. My point is I don't care about the profits. I care about the school and about the regular students concerns concerning this very issue. I don't care about competing with AU over enrollment size nor do I care about jumping 10 spots in the Princeton Review's rankings. I care about sustaining the things I love about the University for my kids, and to that, I think Witt is demolishing. I want that small school feel. I want my kids to have a relationship with their professors and for their teachers to be qualified and to be professors. Not saying all GTA's are bad, but having Professors is much better. I don't want tuition for anyone going up 18% a year. I want walking from class to class a reality. This one characteristics sets us apart from UGA and AU. I also like having my 10 oclock classes and none on Friday's. And I like having a computer in the computer lab to be available when I need one. This might all sound selfish but when its my money going towards these things I expect it, and these things are going away quickly as enrollment increases. Not to mention, trying to get from Hackberry to the ten Hoor parking lot taking 35 minutes and your car overheating on the way and you having to park on the Strip and running so you won't be late on the third day of class.

Also in the presentation, there was no mention of where new academic facilities were going to be built. Maybe I missed something, but they will have to be built away from the "core" of campus similar to Shelby Hall. i guess Shelby Hall is another issue altogether.
You sound like you want everything your way but it's not going to happen. Get used to it, the rest of your life will be that way.

You talk about taking 35 minutes to get from Hackberry to Ten Hoor. Ever thought about walking? You can easily do that in a 10 minute stroll. I made the trek from New Row to Bidgood many times.

You asked about new academic buildings? There won't be a huge need because the university already has the space but it needs to be utilized better. That means more Friday classes. Sorry, I had those too.
 

4Q Basket Case

FB|BB Moderator
Staff member
Nov 8, 2004
10,682
16,304
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Tuscaloosa
Biglittlelittle -- I have to agree with WRhodesTider. You're asking for the best of all worlds, with no tradeoffs whatsoever, and criticizing Witt for not being able to deliver:

You want: a top quality student body -- top to bottom with no dummies, small enrollment, first rate facilities and equipment, top flight faculty, a national reputation for research, combined with a teaching mentality, all the while fulfilling the mission of a state university. Oh yeah, you want it now and you don't want to pay much for it, either.

Can I come to your house at Christmastime? Seems that Santa Claus really does show up there.

Witt is making the short-run tradeoff of a small percentage of of the student body not truly qualifying for more prestigious schools in order to get most of what you're after: facilities & equipment, national-class students at the top end via scholarships, and well-paid faculty.

He's financing that by increasing enrollment. Your statement that you "don't care about profits" only the quality of the school, is naiively dismissive of the realities of the marketplace. The money has to come from somewhere. It isn't coming from the State of Alabama, and you don't want to pay increased tuition. Any ideas other than increasing enrollment?

In the longer term, the plan is to reduce the number of low-end students, replacing them with the higher tiers. Those higher tiers being attracted by the quality of the facilities and faculty, with out-of-state students attracted by the relative low cost. That will take time, but it will happen.

Witt has a vision and is acting on it. For the first time since Dr. Frank Rose, we have a true Chief Executive in the President's office, not an academic. Witt has world-class academic credentials, but he's no ivory tower type with a high IQ and a pointy head.

Dr. Robert Witt is the best thing to hit this campus since 1958.
 

CapstoneGrad06

Hall of Fame
Jan 19, 2006
7,105
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Houston, Texas
biglittlelittle said:
I'm not against progress either. I just think you should make improvements and be content with the size of the school. That is the size that the infrastructure can maintain. And with the current two lane roads, number of classrooms, a few more students is about all the University can hold. Age the wine, instead of making more wine. Unless we turn University, Hackberry, Campus Dr. and Paul W Bryant into 4 lane roads through campus, I don't see much hope in all of these increases in enrollment, without serious problems. And developing those roads in such a manner is not very plausible.
I'm just saying that our limitations within the state call on us to use the options I talked about. To improve facilities we have to use a variety of methods; donations, increased enrollment, and govenment bonds among them. I know it may dampen the overall quality of students coming in but that may be the risk we have to take to improve the school. I'm not sure what the best way to do this is. All I know is that we have limitations that make this process difficult and I'm open to ideas in the name of progress.

As far as the small class size goes, we may see a small redcution in the student/professor ratio; however, Witt needs to increase the faculty numbers quite a but to reach that. But it will not reach the ratio seen at smaller schools no matter what we do. You really don't see a good ratio at too many top-tier academic institutions.

As for the commuting time, I would refer you to the campus master plan. Witt is proposing to make our beautiful campus a walking campus within the next 3-5 years. He has proposed more parking decks with busing stations to transport students from the perimeter to specific drop-off zones on the campus. I believe in the Fall of 2007 we will see many streets around the campus shut down to accomodate this, as I believe all the four streets surrouding the Quad are to be closed to emergency and pedestrian traffic only.
 
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biglittlelittle

1st Team
Aug 14, 2005
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I know it did seem that I wanted the best of both worlds. I was referring to one comment saying that I wanted Alabama to be a "small school," which is something I have never said. The other comment referred to the University of Alabama striving for the best in all things and wanting to be like UMich and UVA, which I never said that should be our goal. So I had to address both of those and in doing so caused some confusion. Are some of my beefs, Burger King-style, yes. I admit some of those things seem rather selfish, but do I think increasing enrollment is bad, yes. I personally believe the increased enrollment will cause more chaos than the funds can solve, and then you go into a downward spiral bc the only solution is more funds and the only solution to more funds is more enrollment.

I was at the Alabama bookstore down the street from Tutwiler on Paul W Bryant Dr. and went Campus Dr. to go to the Ten Hoor Parking Lot and it took me 35 minutes. Neither roads would be closed and if other orads would close would make those roads even that much more difficult. i ended up parking at the strip behind Lai Lai bc as i said my car overheated. And in order not to get a ticket, I actualy tried to park in a lot I am designated for. I park in the lot designed for Business and history majors. Sure if there was a parking lot handy, I would have parked and walked. But there wasn't. So what do you want me to do, break the rules? I also think closing University Drive is a travesty. That is a drive all of the Alumni and future students should be allowed to make. And I make that drive occasionally, just to admire the beauty of the campus (not during peak traffic hours).
 

BamaFanKyle

All-SEC
Oct 29, 2003
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Yes, ive seen the master plan before and the solution that they seem to have for all the infrastructure problems is "close some roads and have a transit system." Unlike some, I actually have no problem about the increased student population, my problem however is the fact that I just dont see how the university will be able to make the neccessary changes to hold and function with the rapid increase of students like Witt wants so soon. Like I said before you dont move in before you build the house...
 

CapstoneGrad06

Hall of Fame
Jan 19, 2006
7,105
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Houston, Texas
I assume that for us to upgrade and bulid more facilities we have to increase student population at the same time. I know Senator Shelby has helped tremendously with government bonds and we have received generous donations, but increased enrollment and increased tuition helps with these things as well.

Now as far as the parking thing goes, I believe we are better than a lot of schools but behind others. Places like Cal-Berkley are terrible, but obviously we don't have no were near that type of population. Auburn and Gerogia have smoothly functioning transit systems, why can't we? Ours continues to be defunct, and for a "walking campus" to strive we need a well-oiled-machine.

Hopefully these things will work themselves out and we can all be proud of our university. We are going through growing pains right now, and difficulties can be expected.
 
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CapstoneGrad06

Hall of Fame
Jan 19, 2006
7,105
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Houston, Texas
biglittlelittle said:
The other comment referred to the University of Alabama striving for the best in all things and wanting to be like UMich and UVA, which I never said that should be our goal.
Are you saying that you did not make that comment or that you don't want to strive for that? I brought that up (wanting to be a Michigan or Virginia) because I want the best for our University. I don't have all the answers to having a university setting that suits all, and to be honest the setting will never suit everyone. However, I would think all supporters of the University would want the best for Alabama and for it to be known around the country for academics and athletics. I gave my ideas as to what is going on and what will have to go on. I don't expect all to agree with them, but I would hope that everyone would want to see the University progress forward, even if that means a little inconvienence in the meantime. These things will sort themselves out over time. Growing pains are going to be felt, but I belive in a few years this project will be one we all look back on and feel glad we embarked on it.
 

4Q Basket Case

FB|BB Moderator
Staff member
Nov 8, 2004
10,682
16,304
337
Tuscaloosa
biglittlelittle said:
...I admit some of those things seem rather selfish, but do I think increasing enrollment is bad, yes. I personally believe the increased enrollment will cause more chaos than the funds can solve, and then you go into a downward spiral bc the only solution is more funds and the only solution to more funds is more enrollment.

[Long sad story about a car breaking down in traffic and trouble finding parking]
OK, BLL....You started this, but now the ball's back in your court. What do you suggest?

It's infinitely easier to throw rocks than build a bridge. You don't like Witt's solution, so stop throwing rocks and build. What's your solution?

Consider your proposal carefully. Regardless of your intentions, you WILL make tradeoffs.

Offer to converse via PM is still open.
 

TurningTide

1st Team
Dec 17, 2004
886
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rkwilkerson said:
I agree, more students is better,

more students = more profit, more profit = better facilities


so what if we have some really dumb ppl here, We are a state school :)

we aren't talking harvard or yale, we are a football school


if we could have 25,000 students in a state with a total population of 4 million


that is getting the message across, that ppl (dumb or smart) want to attend

I want alabama to surpass Auburn in enrollment

I do not want to be a research school, I want a school that I can come back to after I graduate, I want to be around some drunk rednecks, b/c they make tailgating fun

I don't want to sit on the quad and work on math equations before kick-off

that's just my $0.02
This is quite simply the most absurd post I have ever read on Tidefans.com.


ANYWAY, Do you people think that the quality of students/education suffers at GA, where student population is well over 30k? How about FL or Michigan where there are 50k students? NO. The University's resources will grow with more students, and Bama's quality of students is in no way declining based on the numbers of Freshmen entering with 4.0's. What are you people complaining about???
 
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BamaFanKyle

All-SEC
Oct 29, 2003
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Sorry Charles, They have good points...I will complain to the umpteenth degree about them raising tuition every freaking year, but I will accept it because I have to. My MAIN beef though is that they raise out of state tuition almost twice the percentage of what they raise in state. Look around at other universities in the south and they raise out of and in state tuition the same percentage when they have an increase. Also as for someone saying that they want UA to become a UM or UVA...sorry, that's never going to happen. Someone has already pointed out that their academic standards are a lot higher than UA's. Also jsut for reference here is a chart from their website:

Estimated 2006-2007 Fall/Winter (September - April)
Cost of Attendance

Michigan Residents
(In-State)
Fr/So
$20,178

Jr/Sr
$21,348

Grad
$29,856

Nonresidents
(Out-of-State)
Fr/So
$39,936

Jr/Sr
$41,972

Grad
$44,270

That's for ONE year. People pay that kind of money because of what they usually know their degree is going to be worth after they graduate; and (in UM's case inparticular) the university is VERY WELL known across the country. As much as it might hurt to say, UA is not a UM, nor will it be anytime in the near future and simply adding more students won't change that fact either.
 

Capstone46

1st Team
Jun 5, 2000
897
1
0
This topic thread opened up with a link to Dr. Witt's comments. Dr. Witt said "The University of Alabama is a university in transition, and the end point of that transition is recognition as one of the leading public universities in the country." Based on a few of the replies I've read, I'm not sure some read his remarks in full. To have a better idea where the University is headed it would also help to review the Campus Master Plan. Opinions in developing that plan are solicited from everyone. There is a link on the site for students, faculty, staff, alumni, or any concerned party to offer their input. The primary goal of the strategic plan is to "Return the campus to its first principles of organization, planning and design while responding to new needs and demands: Creating an Academic Village, Pedestrian acessibility, and to create prominent outdoor spaces to support student life."

I am not questioning anyone's love for the University. I believe some of the comments posted here are sincere, but some are sincerely wrong.
Biglittlelittle, you asked for a different perspective. I will offer you one and I will base mine on the facts.

You said the growth would be okay if it were a 10 year plan and not a 3-5 year plan. The fact is it is a 10 year plan and we are in the third year of that 10 plan. The goal is a modest and resonable 4% increase over the 10 years to put the enrollment at 28,000 in 2012.

You said you run into as many people with 17 ACT's and 2.5 high school gpa's as you do with those who have the top end ACT scores. You must be wandering around somewhere off campus because it will require a 20 on the ACT for this year's incoming freshmen. You can call undergraduate admissions in the morning to confirm that fact. Yes, there are some exceptions but the 18's and 19's with the 2.5 gpa's start in summer school on a fast-start program before being fully admitted in the fall. Since Dr. Witt implemented his plan three years ago, the average ACT scores have gone up with every incoming freshmen class. The requirements to be admitted have also gone up every year. This fall's incoming freshmen class will have the highest average gpa of any previous incoming freshmen class. As of last Friday there will be a total of 187 National Merit Finalist and National Hispanic Scholars -and that total could pass 200 this fall. The number of students enrolled into Honors College will also be a record. This year's incoming freshmen class will be the largest ever and it will be come with the highest academic qualifications.

You said the University intentionally inflated the enrollment numbers to over 21,000 for the sake of rankings but the actual number was closer to 20,000. I am tempted to ask how you were able to personally determine and verify that count. The fact is that the University is required to report their actual enrollment numbers to the state each October. That actual number escapes me right now but I believe it was close to 21,725 last fall.

You expressed concerns about the professor to student ratio. Those are legitimate concerns and Dr. Witt is committed to maintaining the existing low ratio. Of the public universities in the south (ACC and SEC) the University of Alabama ranks number three -only behind UVA and UNC in professor to student ratio. When Dr. Witt arrived on campus he conducted a study that determined our classroom facilities were dramatically under utilized. He realized we could eaily increase enrollment and promised the faculty they would be compensated for the increased enrollment. He has delivered on that promise. He has also promised additional faculty would be hired to maintain our professor to student ratio and he is delivering on that promise by hiring new professors.

You said you wanted to maintain that small school "feel" and that we are losing it. Feelings are subjective and each of us feel things differently. I would never criticize your feelings, but I will share those of some of your classmates. This last weekend Nickless Devin was one of the students who spoke to the annual Denny Society meeting. Devin is a mechanical engineering senior from a small Texas town of 2,000. He had many scholarship offers coming out of high school and was on the way to investigate Ga Tech when he stopped in Tuscaloosa along the way. Out of curiousity he visited the University of Alabama. He never made it to Ga Tech. He will tell you of all the schools he visited that the University of Alabama was the one that had the small school feel and felt like a place he could belong. Nickless also served as a Capstone Man for three years and conducted countless campus tours for visitors and prospective students. The number one comment by visitors is that we have beautiful campus with a sense of community that is different from most other schools. Surveys of students who enroll and graduate from the University always list the sense of community as one of the most important features of the campus. If you read and understand the complete Campus Master Plan, I think most will see that is a primary goal of the plan. The core of the campus will become pedestrian and bikes only. Concrete will be replaced with green belts. The original campus was not designed to have automobiles or parking problems so they will be greatly reduced and eliminated in some places. Trollies will run 20-22 hours a day into the core of the campus and eliminate most of the traffic congestion problems. Academic villages for each college will make it possible for students to walk to their classes. You mentioned that "students will be taking buses from classes to classes". That will not be the case. I seriously doubt you are driving your car from class to class now.

You mentioned that one of your professors implied that to be a top 15 research university would detract from being a great teaching institution. I disagree. Being a great research institution brings in money in the form of grants, top professors to participate in the research, and top students to learn in that environment. Dr. Witt has brought in Dr. Keith McDowell whose job is to develop research money for the University. He has been very successful and so have our professors. Dr. Robin Rogers from our school of chemistry is doing some very exciting and profitable work in the area of ionic liquids in the green chemistry field. Recently the chemical giant BASF bought the rights to that research with a contract that could provide the University over $200 million dollars in the next few years. The University of Indiana developed Crest toothpaste and is still receiving millions every year from thqat discovery. In addition to his research Dr. Rogers is one of our most passionate educators on campus.

Lowend, You mentioned that you were offered a Presidential Scholarship to attend the University of Alabama coming out of high school. Congratulations, and I mean that sincerely since I know what you had to do to earn that opportunity. I serve on a number of scholarship committees and boards and yours was a top tier scholarship opportunity. Let me ask a few questions for you to answer to yourself. You said YOU decided on your own free will to turn down that scholarship, is that correct? You chose to go elsewhere, didn't you? I respect that choice for whatever reasons you made it. When you transferred back to Alabama you complained that you got no financial aid. Did you expect the University to hold that scholarship money for you, or pass it on to someone else who earned, desired and needed it? You act as if scholarship money is an entitlement but it is not. It was offered to you as a gift but you declined to accept it, didn't you? Did you decide to transfer back to Alabama on your own free will from the B'ham school where you wish you could get your diploma now? Were you forced to transfer to Alabama? You have announced that the University Alumni will not get any of your donations. That is certainly your choice. I firmly believe that they that develop the resources should have the right to distribute them however they chose to do so. But do you know what the Alumni Association does with their money? They offer it to students in the form of scholarships, scholarship money that YOU declined to accept.....and you blame the alumni for your choice. For the record the University of Alabama Alumni offered and distributed a record amount of scholarship money last year. It was more than any other Alumni Association in the country. They have been #1 in that category for 9 of the last 10 years.

CT you mentioned that a few of your professors have seen a reduction of the average quality of incoming students. I don't doubt they said that but the enrollment facts dispute that claim. I know a number of our professors and call many friends, but most professors find it very easy to complain They especially dislike change. Some would find it very difficult to exist outside the academic world. I was having coffee with one of our long time professors from the business school one day when the discussion turned to a subject before the faculty senate. I asked the professor if she had ever considered serving in the senate. Her response was classic, "Are you kidding? They are all a bunch of crazies with their own personal agendas and looking for a platform. No body in their right mind would want to get involved in that mess." I am certainly not saying that all outspoken professors are "crazies" or are wrong in their comments, but I have learned that many have their own personal agenda when they speak out.
The Riverside and Lakeside resident halls were built outside the core of the campus but close enough for those students to walk to their classes. The peaceful lake (Palmer Lake) which you referred to was a cesspool of drainage from the entire campus. It will be cleaned and enlarged and the new lake will support marine life. The biology department will study both plant and marine life in the new much cleaner lake. Unfortunately your walking view of the lake will be somewhat restricted by the new dining hall that will sit next to the lake. The lower level of the dining hall will have a large terrace that sits out on the lake. When the old dorms (Palmer, Sommerville, Paty and the others) are taken down there will be a large green Quad like area around the lake. Some of those dorms will start coming down in the next two weeks. Yes, there will be some new dorms built in the area but there will be significantly more green space in the area between Rose and the core campus. Dr. Witt will not "rip away campus beauty by adding cement sidewalks". The exact opposite will occur when the Master Plan is implemented. Less cars, less traffic, fewer streets but more walkers, more bicycles, more green areas, more trees should all add up to make the campus even more beautiful.

Yes, The University of Alabama is growing but it is growing towards the worthy goals that Dr. Witt has set for our University. As he mentioned in his opening remarks of the linked article, we are in a period of transition. Change does disrupt some things. We may not all agree what are the best changes, but change is essential for growth and development. Does anybody remember the seating capacity of Bryant Denny Stadium when it was originally built? Seems like it was 29,000 or so. But the game of football has grown and changed. The players are faster and bigger. They wear different pads, equipment and helmets. The MDB uniforms and the music the band plays is different. The cheerleaders wear totally different uniforms. This fall when the expanded new stadium opens there will be a record number of fans in the stadium. Having the new end zone expansion will create a new exciting atmosphere at BDS. The growth of the University over the next few years will bring the same result. If any of us had been a student at the University in '29 and a spectator in the stands of that first game, none of us could have possibly imagined the growth of the University and BDS in less than a century.

Change is inevitable. It is coming to the University whether we prepare for it or not. We should be thankful we have a visionary leader like Dr. Bob Witt who has a strategic plan for our growth. Simply put, I think he will make the University a better place....and I think Mike Shula will do the same thing for the football team! I think our best days are ahead of us.
 

Capstone46

1st Team
Jun 5, 2000
897
1
0
I have made at least one mistake on my long post. Instead of referring to our professor to student ratio, I should have said average class size. If I remember correctly, the average class size is around 22 which is the third lowest of public universities in the SEC/ACC.
 

biglittlelittle

1st Team
Aug 14, 2005
612
0
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40
I apologize for having some of my facts wrong especially concerning admissions requirements, etc. Whatever it is, it seems as if its too low, and that's just my opinion. They must've raised it after I got here, cuz I've met some doozies.

Those figures of 21000+ are off because that number is only the number of people that report to school in the fall, if I'm not mistaken. I don't believe they ever advertise how many students are registered for the spring which is a much lower number or even those that remain in school after the drop/add. Just an aside, the beginning of the school year and the beginning of the semesters are when traffic is the worst. People soon withdraw and drop out and quit going to class and traffic becomes much more managable. Thus shows how much worse if we inreased enrollment by 33%.

I still do not see 28,000 students fitting, no matter how you draw it and squeeze it in the master plan over any time span, and it being manageable for the city of Tuscaloosa. Transit system, pedestrian campus, closed quad, more professors, and more dorms and facilities all combined won't overcome too many people. I don't see 28,000 students plus the needed increases in faculty etc. working and it being comfortable for the students. It comes down to customer service. I honestly hope we don't get that many people to come to school at the University of Alabama, even if it is the plan. I don't doubt the ability of the University of Alabama to attract great students. I don't doubt the University can attract anybody they want to. But sooner or later, these "growing pain" feelings are going to "transition" into "maybe we didn't see all of the consequences of this enrollment" feelings and now we are sitting on all of this debt. Looks like we need to dip into the endowment or need to sign up some more students if these problems persist.

If the problem with traffic to the center of campus is relieved then the traffic around the "core campus" is going to be that much worse. You don't solve overpopulation problems, you just move it to somewhere else and make it a problem there. Mass is neither made nor destroyed. I want what's best for the University, and I don't see how a steady population of around 20000 students is bad or how 28,000 students is going to be better. I understand inflation and a steady increase of tuition is necessary, especially after examining some U of A financial reports from 2004. But the general idea is making what we have better vs making it bigger and I don't believe they can go together. I don't consider maintaining a steady enrollment maintaining the status quo. I see it as maintaining and perfecting the maintainable.

BTW if anyone was screwed out of a decent incoming scholarship it was probably me, Mr. Capstone46.

Also averages are nothing more than, as Mark Twain puts it, "there are lies, damned lies, and statistics."
 

TerryP

Suspended
Oct 8, 1999
1,000
6
0
biglittlelittle said:
I actually pay $7,000 and some change a semester in tuition, given that I am out of state. Compare that to the $5,600 a semester I was paying my freshman year. You don't want me telling parents of future out of state students that they may......
In all honesty, that's your fault. I spent a total of one semester as an out of state student. It's all about what you present.

File taxes as an Alabama resident. Join a church. Join a civic org. The list goes on.

I made a petition to declare myself as a resident...went through without the least bit of questioning.
 
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