Arian Foster goes public as a non-believer

[92tide]

That is the crux of the issue isn't it?

For me there are two reasons:

1. Purpose in life. What am I here for? Is this all there is to it? What am I going to do with my life? Responses to those kind of questions are rooted in one of two things. A selfish getting the most out of the time that you have, or a higher purpose. That is not to say that belief in God is necessary for the latter. Plenty of people who do not believe in God are altruistic. But there is a much different mindset when the goal is rooted in what happens after physical death.
2. Loss. I can't imagine the pain of the death of a loved one without that hope of something after a physical death. Complete loss instead of a hope of seeing them again is a horrible thing to endure.

understood.

for me, religion provides me [some] hope and guidance in my life now. i think that altruism [whether religious or not] is fully achievable without the expectation of a final reward, and i see the possibility of being altruistic because of love for our fellow humans to be a wonderful and beautiful mindset that does not need the promise of eternal life to come to fruition.

i have lost many loved ones an while it is hard, i also carry on the wonderful time i had with them with me and hope to pass some of that on to those who know me. i don't spend a lot of time worrying about being re-united with lost love ones. again, this is just me.

 

[Jon]

The Foster video made me feel uneasy, almost as if this is the next agenda for the media once they get finished with gay rights. At the very least, it seems they are testing the waters. I certainly hope and pray the media doesn't start to glorify being atheist. If someone reaches that decision on their on, well OK, but being a Christian leads to such a fulfilling life for any who search in depth and it's tough enough already trying to spread the word. It's so much easier to just decide there is no god than it is to understand why there are catastrophes and tragedies or why Christianity is not just another myth. Foster didn't have any answer for his daughter when she asked about Zeus, so why wouldn't she wonder if there is a difference in Greek mythology and Christianity?

really resonated with me because it was the same question I had as a little kid. The answer is that there is no difference. There are 5,000 or so gods that humans have believed in over the last few thousand years that we are aware of and there are likely thousands more that we have no record of but where once held as absolute truth by billions of long dead people who knew, with absolute certainty that they were 100% right in their beliefs. The truth is you only believe in god/jesus because you were born in America to parents who do and in a culture that did. If you were born in Jordan or Saudi Arabia you'd "know you were right in your heart" about Mohamed and Allah, in India you'd feel that way about Ganesh and the rest of the crew, in Jerusalem about Yahweh but not Jesus....etc, etc


Now as far as the first point. Sorry it makes you uneasy but us non-believers are here, we're not ..... (well some are but not me) get used to it

 

[92tide]

really resonated with me because it was the same question I had as a little kid. The answer is that there is no difference. There are 5,000 or so gods that humans have believed in over the last few thousand years that we are aware of and there are likely thousands more that we have no record of but where once held as absolute truth by billions of long dead people who knew, with absolute certainty that they were 100% right in their beliefs. The truth is you only believe in god/jesus because you were born in America to parents who do and in a culture that did. If you were born in Jordan or Saudi Arabia you'd "know you were right in your heart" about Mohamed and Allah, in India you'd feel that way about Ganesh and the rest of the crew, in Jerusalem about Yahweh but not Jesus....etc, etc


Now as far as the first point. Sorry it makes you uneasy but us non-believers are here, we're not ..... (well some are but not me) get used to it

beer also rhymes with here

 

[chanson78]

beer also rhymes with here

Are you saying atheism turns people into beer?

It's like a hipster version of the water to wine miracle.

 

[TideEngineer08]

really resonated with me because it was the same question I had as a little kid. The answer is that there is no difference. There are 5,000 or so gods that humans have believed in over the last few thousand years that we are aware of and there are likely thousands more that we have no record of but where once held as absolute truth by billions of long dead people who knew, with absolute certainty that they were 100% right in their beliefs. The truth is you only believe in god/jesus because you were born in America to parents who do and in a culture that did. If you were born in Jordan or Saudi Arabia you'd "know you were right in your heart" about Mohamed and Allah, in India you'd feel that way about Ganesh and the rest of the crew, in Jerusalem about Yahweh but not Jesus....etc, etc


Now as far as the first point. Sorry it makes you uneasy but us non-believers are here, we're not ..... (well some are but not me) get used to it

There is a difference. Refusal to acknowledge that is to be intellectually dishonest or lazy.

In the end, yes, faith is required. You'll never get past that.

 

[Jon]

beer also rhymes with here

actually surprised the Q word is censored here, it's a word that crowd has embraced. I find that odd but I find all of the "baby talk only" policy here odd but I do respect the wishes of Brett and crew that want that for whatever reason

 

[Jon]

There is a difference. Refusal to acknowledge that is to be intellectually dishonest or lazy.

In the end, yes, faith is required. You'll never get past that.

If the difference you are referring to is that one is still believed then OK there is that difference. Outside of that there is none that I can see. I can be lazy but I try very hard for intellectual honesty, what is the difference?

 

[92tide]

Are you saying atheism turns people into beer?

It's like a hipster version of the water to wine miracle.

heh, only if it involves pbr

damn hipsters co-opt everything

 

[TideEngineer08]

If the difference you are referring to is that one is still believed then OK there is that difference. Outside of that there is none that I can see. I can be lazy but I try very hard for intellectual honesty, what is the difference?

No, that is not what my reference is. There are numerous discussions that have occurred on this board about it, there is Google, and there are a wealth of books out there on the subject should you choose to pursue the topic in an open-minded way.

Part of the problem with simply lumping Christianity in with mythology is that folks like Paul, Peter, etc. are actually real people that lived and breathed. They witnessed many things, wrote about them, witnessed to many communities about what they had experienced. They all died horrible deaths that could have been avoided if they simply said, ok, we were making this up. None of them did that. They were disconnected from one another, there was no email, no phones. It would have been an impossible conspiracy to carry out. Any of them could have opted to say hey, I made this up, and then none of their "co-conspirators" would have known. But, they all died horrific deaths by not relenting to the pressure to admit they were lying.

Yes, it takes faith. As I said, you're not going to get past that. But it's not blind faith, and I don't believe in myths.

 

[Go Bama]

really resonated with me because it was the same question I had as a little kid. The answer is that there is no difference. There are 5,000 or so gods that humans have believed in over the last few thousand years that we are aware of and there are likely thousands more that we have no record of but where once held as absolute truth by billions of long dead people who knew, with absolute certainty that they were 100% right in their beliefs. The truth is you only believe in god/jesus because you were born in America to parents who do and in a culture that did. If you were born in Jordan or Saudi Arabia you'd "know you were right in your heart" about Mohamed and Allah, in India you'd feel that way about Ganesh and the rest of the crew, in Jerusalem about Yahweh but not Jesus....etc, etc


Now as far as the first point. Sorry it makes you uneasy but us non-believers are here, we're not ..... (well some are but not me) get used to it

That's a question almost all children have. The answers for me are that the Bible does not read like a myth and Jesus was a historical figure recognized by other religions. The Bible does not read like a Greek, Roman, Egyptian, Norse, or Icelandic myth. I haven't read all mythology nor entertained all religions, but I chose Christianity because it was the faith I found to be most true. Paraphrasing CS Lewis, Jesus was either who he said he was, or he was the biggest charlatan in the history of man. His disciples believed in him so much that they were willing to die.

I know you are here and am glad of it. If you are interested in how Lewis went from being atheist to being Christian, I recommend "Surprised By Joy".

I didn't understand your last two sentences. Both are incomplete.

 

[Al A Bama]

Everyone has a right to their opinion.

You are right. No one forces anyone to believe. We have free will. However, I've heard that a lot of people who don't believe convert on their death bed.

 

[bamahippie]

No, that is not what my reference is. There are numerous discussions that have occurred on this board about it, there is Google, and there are a wealth of books out there on the subject should you choose to pursue the topic in an open-minded way.

Part of the problem with simply lumping Christianity in with mythology is that folks like Paul, Peter, etc. are actually real people that lived and breathed. They witnessed many things, wrote about them, witnessed to many communities about what they had experienced. They all died horrible deaths that could have been avoided if they simply said, ok, we were making this up. None of them did that. They were disconnected from one another, there was no email, no phones. It would have been an impossible conspiracy to carry out. Any of them could have opted to say hey, I made this up, and then none of their "co-conspirators" would have known. But, they all died horrific deaths by not relenting to the pressure to admit they were lying.

Yes, it takes faith. As I said, you're not going to get past that. But it's not blind faith, and I don't believe in myths.

This.

Atheism is a choice, as is believing faith.

Hebrews 11:1 (KJV) Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
(AMP) Now faith is the assurance (the confirmation, [a]the title deed) of the things [we] hope for, being the proof of things [we] do not see and the conviction of their reality [faith perceiving as real fact what is not revealed to the senses].
(CEV) Faith makes us sure of what we hope for and gives us proof of what we cannot see.
(NIV) Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see.

Contrary to popular belief, faith can even be intellectually honest.

Hope beyond my death is less being with those that have passed before (though that will be cool), but being with and around the One who made me, and changed my life/marriage/purpose/etc. Yep, that will be awesome. And believing that I will be there requires faith. And it beats thinking that I will only be a corpse, and then bones, and then nothing in a grave, without a soul and eternal destiny.

 

[mittman]

...
Hope beyond my death is less being with those that have passed before (though that will be cool), but being with and around the One who made me, and changed my life/marriage/purpose/etc. Yep, that will be awesome. And believing that I will be there requires faith. And it beats thinking that I will only be a corpse, and then bones, and then nothing in a grave, without a soul and eternal destiny.

I agree completely. That came later for me, and I was also approaching the point from a secular point of view. Finding purpose in life, and attempting to fill voids with things that never could fill them was what made me start and kept me seeking. This is nothing new. Belief in God does not exempt someone from these struggles. Even Solomon (the benchmark for wisdom) wrote about having them.

For me belief came in overlapping stages:
A intellectual discussion with myself of science, creation, nature
A philosophical discussion with myself of human nature and psychology
Studying different religions and theological stances on those religions

It took a while for me to develop layers of belief. As I did the proof came in waves. Many of them very profound.

 

[CajunCrimson]

To me, the fact that Arian Foster is making over $8 million a year, is a true sign that there is a God.....

Arianism is a nontrinitarian belief that asserts that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, but is entirely distinct from and subordinate to God the Father.

 

[bamahippie]

Arianism is a nontrinitarian belief that asserts that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, but is entirely distinct from and subordinate to God the Father.

LOL, I thought the same thing, regarding his name...

 

[81usaf92]

Back to the article... Why was this the biggest story yesterday on espn?

 

[92tide]

Back to the article... Why was this the biggest story yesterday on espn?

because espn has to fill airtime

 

[RedStar]

because espn has to fill airtime

ESPN is losing viewers left and right. This doesn't strike me as a story that resonates with a big crowd.

 

[92tide]

ESPN is losing viewers left and right. This doesn't strike me as a story that resonates with a big crowd.

i have never cared for espn.

 

[CajunCrimson]

Back to the article... Why was this the biggest story yesterday on espn?

We actually were still on the article -- but perhaps not to your liking?