Question for older Bama fans about ties in a game.

  • HELLO AGAIN, Guest! We are back, live! We're still doing some troubleshooting and maintenance to fix a few remaining issues but everything looks stable now (except front page which we're working on over next day or two)

    Thanks for your patience and support! MUCH appreciated! --Brett (BamaNation)

    if you see any problems - please post them in the Troubleshooting board!

STONECOLDSABAN

Hall of Fame
Sep 21, 2007
5,131
7,421
187
Mobile, AL
So this is probably a Selma question or a question I should have waited till the off season to ask. but hyping the TSIO I ran across the 93 game. That is the only tie I have ever remembered in my life and I was a kid when it happened.. I know the phrase “ties are like kissing your sister” but the 93 game felt more like a win cause we trolled Tennessee.

My question is. Did ties in general feel as bad as a loss or was it something different?
 
Last edited:
In person, we felt like we won. The crowd went insane and UT fans were livid. Hahahaha

Edit for a little more context: That tie preserved out long unbeaten streak that went all the way back to '91 and we spent most of the game looking like we were going to lose. Taking the win away from Tennessee at the end felt like we really stole one.
 
Last edited:
In person, we felt like we won. The crowd went insane and UT fans were livid. Hahahaha

Edit for a little more context: That tie preserved out long unbeaten streak that went all the way back to '91 and we spent most of the game looking like we were going to lose. Taking the win away from Tennessee at the end felt like we really stole one.
Exactly my point. The one tie I witnessed wasn’t a Normal tie. In 1992 when langham and Teague were skull dragging the rest of college football. Michigan went 9-0-3. I just want to know for the old heads ..did a tie feel as bad as a loss or was it seen different to yall??
 
I would agree that in the early CPB years in the 50's a tie was just kind of a blah event, but after winning the 1961 national championship until OT went into affect it felt like a loss. BTW the Alabama vs Tennessee game in October of 1965 ended in a 7-7 tie when Ken Stabler thinking it was 3rd down threw a pass out of bounds to stop the clock only to realize it was 4th down. Game over 7-7.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kenbama and UAH
I didn't mind ties at all... I think if you have two teams that battle it out and tie, that is the way it should be rather than overtime. I think OT is artificial the way they set it up. I am glad that they have started doing the two point conversion on round two and following given how long some of the games went on before.

The '93 Vol game in particular felt like a win, because we did nothing all game and then scored at the last second and Palmer had to make the two point conversion to get us there. I thought we would lose for certain! Everyone in the stadium and watching knew Palmer would get the ball and Tennessee was hapless in trying to stop him.
 
I didn't mind ties at all... I think if you have two teams that battle it out and tie, that is the way it should be rather than overtime. I think OT is artificial the way they set it up. I am glad that they have started doing the two point conversion on round two and following given how long some of the games went on before.

The '93 Vol game in particular felt like a win, because we did nothing all game and then scored at the last second and Palmer had to make the two point conversion to get us there. I thought we would lose for certain! Everyone in the stadium and watching knew Palmer would get the ball and Tennessee was hapless in trying to stop him.
david palmer, the o.g. wildcat
 
With the exception of the 93 game, most ties I remember were very blah because you invested in watching a game that was basically meaningless.

I was so distraught that we were going to lose to Tenneesse and that we had done nothing the entire game that when we came back in the final seconds and tied it felt that we stole something from Tennersee.
 
So this is probably a Selma question or a question I should have waited till the off season to ask. but hyping the TSIO I ran across the 93 game. That is the only tie I have ever remembered in my life and I was a kid when it happened.. I know the phrase “ties are like kissing your sister” but the 93 game felt more like a win cause we trolled Tennessee.

My question is. Did ties in general feel as bad as a loss or was it something different?

Context mattered.

The key component with Tennessee in 1993 is the fact we had not lost a game in over two years AND the fact that we were down 8 points, so a tie was the best we could attain. Had we been down by 7 and PLAYED FOR A TIE, there would have been serious calls from the fanbase (but nobody else) to fire Stallings.

Largely, it mattered whether:
a) the game ENDED in a tie OR
b) somebody PLAYED for a tie

Alabama had three tie games when it could happen during my fandom:
1981 USM
1985 LSU
1993 Tennessee

The reactions to those three in order were, "we blew it," "I'm confused," and "whew!"

The most frustrating of those three was probably the 1985 LSU game. We scored to cut the gap to 14-13 with something like 83 seconds left. Perkins then opted to kick the point after and tie the game. Frank Broyles was puzzled beyond words and there was another aspect: Alabama had no timeouts left and yet Perkins's "reasoning" (excuse?) was to say, "I thought we would get down there and get a turnover." Now bear in mind that LSU HAD NOT TURNED THE BALL OVER THE ENTIRE GAME!!!

But Perkins says his - excuse, which is what it was - was "I thought we'd get a turnover." Fine, except LSU had a better QB than we did, and they had three timeouts. And so they drove all the way down to attempt a last play 24-yard field goal that Ron Lewis shanked. So we.....well, we felt "relieved" we were still technically in the SEC race, but we were now depending on Tennessee to mess the bed against Ole Miss, Kentucky, or Vandy.

I guess - if one gets technical - we can say that Perkins's thought process went like this, maybe this can be defended:
a) we have no timeouts left and they have three
b) that puts the entire game on the onsides kick for us
c) if we win, Tennessee HAS to win all three of their games
d) and their all-SEC quarterback is gone for the season, so maybe.....

The win would NOT have won us the SEC, it would only have kept us alive.

I just always thought Perkins's approach in that particular game was quite cowardly. I'm guessing his logic was, "Well, Wickersham will have to throw the ball to move down the field, so maybe we can pick it off." But in 1985, Wickersham had both more attempts and completions than any other QB in the SEC. The problem is that Alabama's 1985 defense - which included Cornelius Bennett, Curt Jarvis, and Big John Hand - was a "bend but don't break" defense. We gave up "only" 16.2 ppg that year...but there were 25 better scoring defenses than us.

Now I will add, those numbers are inflated, too. For example, we led Mississippi State, 44-6, in a rainstorm and Perkins wanted his backups to get some reps, so MSU closed the gap artificially to 44-28. Georgia's only TOUCHDOWN on us was a blocked punt with a minute left, although yes, those points go against the defense.

As far as 1981 USM, the game was not on TV, and the story I heard later - because we stopped the clock and enabled USM to line up and tie the game - was some youngster called timeout when he shouldn't have and Coach Bryant threw himself on the sword, which was his job.

So it all depended on context.
 
I would agree that in the early CPB years in the 50's a tie was just kind of a blah event, but after winning the 1961 national championship until OT went into affect it felt like a loss. BTW the Alabama vs Tennessee game in October of 1965 ended in a 7-7 tie when Ken Stabler thinking it was 3rd down threw a pass out of bounds to stop the clock only to realize it was 4th down. Game over 7-7.
I was at that game! Stabler threw to sideline to stop the clock, it took a minute or two for all to realize that was "FOURTH DOWN"!
 
  • Like
Reactions: dtgreg
Let me add something else to this discussion. I can't use the search function on here to find it right now, but when I did my writeup for the 1966 season, I addressed the subject of tie games for a rather obvious reason.

The basic rules of thumb were as follows:
a) if you were UNRANKED and got a tie, it might get you ranked, especially with a high ranked foe
b) 75% of the time, a higher ranked team got punished for the tie
c) a tie hurt you short term but not as much as a loss long-term

A tie could "make" an unranked team seem good and lower a ranked team, but it would even out over the course of a season. Ohio State lost the 1961 national championship to Alabama NOT because they had a season opening tie - but because that tie was against 3-5-2 TCU, who didn't beat ANY of the three SWC teams below them in the standings.

On the other hand, had we not had the tie with Tennessee in 1965, we win the consensus national championship. The tie meant we shared it with Michigan State. A lot of Alabama fans don't realize that once Michigan State and Notre Dame reached their 1966 clash undefeated, A TIE WAS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME for Alabama with the exception of the Irish beating Sparty but losing to USC, which wasn't going to happen. USC's tie with 5-5-1 Stanford cost them a share of the national title, but a loss would have been worse for their hopes. A tie also cost Southern Methodist the 1982 national championship, but they would not have even been in the running with a loss. And Colorado's tie against the Vols in the 1990 opener without their best player (Eric Bienemy) gave a solid argument, "Hey, they'd have won otherwise."

Syracuse is mad to this day that Pat Dye played for a tie in the 1988 Sugar Bowl and ruined their season. On the other hand, Dye did say after the game that if they wanted to do something about it, they should have blocked the field goal.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CoolBreeze
Yes. Context matters.

1985 LSU game everyone around me thought it was a cow turd play and Perkins was afraid to play for the win. We were all saying "Coach Bryant would never do that".

1993 TN game was "Take THAT hillbillies!" we stole their victory from them and it was glorious.
 
  • Thank You
Reactions: selmaborntidefan
The other problem with going for the tie or not was that the odds of making a two point conversion weren't always so great.

Most teams have plays ready and in reserve these days and even then if isn't a given.

What's funny is how many coaches - and two of them were Woody Hayes and Barry Switzer - who said that Tom Osborne should have taken the tie in the 1984 Orange Bowl and then taken his chances on getting the ball back. Most fans and writers felt otherwise, but those guys each won 3 national titles and both said, "You gotta win the championship, if it's a tie, so be it."

Of course, each case is unique. In 1983, Nebraska had the advantage of knowing that every other team in the standings (including Texas, who had lost the Cotton Bowl) had at least one loss. But to his credit, Osborne said he would not vote in favor of a national championship for a coach who had played for a tie to win it.

But most of his peers disagreed with him.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Huckleberry and Con
So this is probably a Selma question or a question I should have waited till the off season to ask. but hyping the TSIO I ran across the 93 game. That is the only tie I have ever remembered in my life and I was a kid when it happened.. I know the phrase “ties are like kissing your sister” but the 93 game felt more like a win cause we trolled Tennessee.

My question is. Did ties in general feel as bad as a loss or was it something different?
Nope. Ties always felt better.
 
I think generally, they are like "kissing your sister."
When you in the middle of a game and it ain't looking good, the mindset evolves into "well, a tie is better than a loss, so let's settle for a tie."
If memory serves, Alabama needed a two-point conversion to get the UT game to a tie.
Yes, Coach Bryant used to say that about kissing your sister. It's a great analogy!
 
  • Thank You
Reactions: Tidewater

Trending content

Advertisement

Latest threads