Offseason Discussion: Top 10 SEC Football Coaches All Time

[selmaborntidefan]

Wanna know what really sickens me?

That I enjoy this kind of discussion more than anything that has happened the last 3 football seasons.

My issue is not "Alabama is no longer winning titles." That's ludicrous given my fandom runs back to 1978 and includes the 2000 debacle (lord that one hurt).

No, the PORTAL is the big problem. The days of player development of that star from a local Alabama high school are long gone.

 

[Alasippi2]

Wanna know what really sickens me?

That I enjoy this kind of discussion more than anything that has happened the last 3 football seasons.

My issue is not "Alabama is no longer winning titles." That's ludicrous given my fandom runs back to 1978 and includes the 2000 debacle (lord that one hurt).

No, the PORTAL is the big problem. The days of player development of that star from a local Alabama high school are long gone.

I agree. Hopefully the act before Congress comes through. To me, it's really simple, If you want college football to be truly great and fair again you do three things. (1) Give every team the same salary cap that includes all N.I.L. deals. If you are caught violating it you get the death penalty for two years or more. (2). Have a collective bargaining agreement that the players vote on and agree too. (3) Have contracts with the players and their parents that spell out exact length of the contract with no transfers within the time frame of the contract. That would solve the transfer portal issue temporarily. That's just a start and it's going to get crazy, but it's our only choice to stop the craziness. "We have more money" should not decide the collegiate national champion in any sport. Just my opinion.

 

[dtgreg]

Wanna know what really sickens me?

That I enjoy this kind of discussion more than anything that has happened the last 3 football seasons.

My issue is not "Alabama is no longer winning titles." That's ludicrous given my fandom runs back to 1978 and includes the 2000 debacle (lord that one hurt).

No, the PORTAL is the big problem. The days of player development of that star from a local Alabama high school are long gone.

Those days MAY be coming back. At least, a little. We're taking 3* projects with high upside now, when, under Saban, we didn't really do that.

 

[CoolBreeze]

Those days MAY be coming back. At least, a little. We're taking 3* projects with high upside now, when, under Saban, we didn't really do that.

Now in this era of pay-for-play one really has to work much harder than in the past especially when competing against billionaire supported, seemingly unlimited budgets. I think we are doing things intelligently focusing in on high school evaluation with an eye on high ceiling guys, player retention and development. Now if we can figure out how to expand our eval reach in our transfer market game like the indy model then we may be on to something. One thing is for certain, character in recruiting has emerged as a very, very important characteristic when shopping for prospects.

 

[TideEngineer08]

Coach Bryant never really had more top end talent than everyone else, the way that Coach Saban did, despite having virtually unlimited scholarships. There is a reason Coach Bryant never had a Heisman winner at Alabama, and that's not necessarily because of some sort of team-first philosophy. It was because he never had a player talented enough to win the award except maybe Joe Namath.

Coach Bryant went after guys he could coach hard and mold into guys who would sell out completely to win. Physically, mentally, emotionally. Almost like you would expect a marine to do. Talent was secondary. That's how Coach Bryant won.

Coach Saban went after the most talented guys in the country, legit 4 or 5 stars, who were also the most coachable. Julio Jones types who were future all-pros willing to lay it all on the line for the team. That is the biggest difference between the two. I'm not sure Coach Bryant's style would still win today, in today's culture. And make no mistake, Coach Saban's style was starting to wane as the culture was changing around him.

I don't think either coach was that much better than the other one when it came to strategies, game plans, etc. But there has never been another coach as driven as Coach Saban. Coach Bryant found time and places to let loose in ways Coach Saban never did. Outside of what, one week a year on the lake, Coach Saban was working 16 hour days. And I'll bet he was still "working" during that one week vacation.

 

[UAH]

Coach Bryant never really had more top end talent than everyone else, the way that Coach Saban did, despite having virtually unlimited scholarships. There is a reason Coach Bryant never had a Heisman winner at Alabama, and that's not necessarily because of some sort of team-first philosophy. It was because he never had a player talented enough to win the award except maybe Joe Namath.

Coach Bryant went after guys he could coach hard and mold into guys who would sell out completely to win. Physically, mentally, emotionally. Almost like you would expect a marine to do. Talent was secondary. That's how Coach Bryant won.

Coach Saban went after the most talented guys in the country, legit 4 or 5 stars, who were also the most coachable. Julio Jones types who were future all-pros willing to lay it all on the line for the team. That is the biggest difference between the two. I'm not sure Coach Bryant's style would still win today, in today's culture. And make no mistake, Coach Saban's style was starting to wane as the culture was changing around him.

I don't think either coach was that much better than the other one when it came to strategies, game plans, etc. But there has never been another coach as driven as Coach Saban. Coach Bryant found time and places to let loose in ways Coach Saban never did. Outside of what, one week a year on the lake, Coach Saban was working 16 hour days. And I'll bet he was still "working" during that one week vacation.

Bryant had four difficult years 1967-1970. He said he had taken his eye off the ball considering the NFL and a replacement for him at Alabama. Ithink without question his recruiting had fallen off and staff talent had declined as key assistants left for head coaching positions. To his credit he adapted with the Wishbone and used unlimited scholarships and recruiting outstanding black athletes to put Alabama back on the national stage.

Looking back at Coach Bryant's bowl record Alabama was outmatched from Jan 1,1968 through January 1, 1975 going 1 -7. It is interesting that Alabama and Coach Bryant managed one tie against Texas never managing to beat the Longhorns

CNS brought such intensity to implementing the process and a system of constant recruiting. It seemed exhausting to me as a fan at times. It was an all out effort every day 52 weeks a year. We have discussed his mistakes in coach selection many times. There is little need to revisit that.

Having lived through both careers but not representing myself as any sort of expert, I come away leaning toward Coach Saban for his recruiting and development, his all encompassing process that led to so much success of his teams and individual players following their time at Alabama.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

Coach Bryant never really had more top end talent than everyone else, the way that Coach Saban did, despite having virtually unlimited scholarships. There is a reason Coach Bryant never had a Heisman winner at Alabama, and that's not necessarily because of some sort of team-first philosophy. It was because he never had a player talented enough to win the award except maybe Joe Namath.

If this is saying that recruiting wasn't nearly the national thing in the SEC then that it was later during Saban's time, I can agree with that. Yes, that would limit who comes to Alabama. And - and we can argue this one until doomsday - Bryant was also limited during the segregation era as it was becoming clearer how good black athletes were, to the point he was sending talented blacks off with recommendations to (then) safer places.

But in all honesty - who was Bryant's competition? Billy Cannon won the Heisman in 1959, Spurrier (recruited by us) won it in 1966, Pat Sullivan in 1971 and Herschel in 1982. Most of the Heisman winners during his tenure at Alabama were at places like Notre Dame, Oklahoma, and USC. Plus - as I've said time and again on here - the Heisman Trophy really was a political joke until about 2004 anyway and in some ways still is.

Sometimes, I think this is the argument of the old guys vs the not as old guys, though. I don't think it's fair to say "Bryant couldn't have won in this era" because one thing that CAN be assumed with good coaches, particularly in CFB, is their ability to adjust. And "well Saban got all the talent," but he didn't have that at Michigan State, and he didn't have that at LSU, and he turned both around.

We are fortunate that he didn't stay at LSU beyond 2004 else the Tigers today would be the Alabama Dynasty of 2008-21.

I think the fairest thing to both coaches is to view them in context of their time - and in that viewpoint, Bryant was the best coach of the 1960s and 1970s while Saban was the best coach of the 00s and 10s. I have no hesitation saying that about both coaches.

 

[TideEngineer08]

I think the fairest thing to both coaches is to view them in context of their time - and in that viewpoint, Bryant was the best coach of the 1960s and 1970s while Saban was the best coach of the 00s and 10s. I have no hesitation saying that about both coaches.

Neither do I.

My point was about Coach Bryant's strategy. His method. Not his capabilities. He recruited and got who he wanted, for the most part, much like Coach Saban. I'm simply saying (while star ratings weren't a thing back then) Coach Bryant did not seem to go after the 4 or 5 star guy. He went after the guy who had the attitude of do or die, regardless of talent. He said so, explicitly. He wanted guys who would never quit and he didn't care so much about their ability to move on to the NFL.

Coach Saban was different in that, while he certainly cared about attitude and devoted a ton of energy toward that end in his program, he also cared about talent level and whether or not you were good enough to get to the NFL (in that, were you good enough to move on to the NFL, you would win championships in college so long as your mind was right).

Before Coach Saban arrived at Alabama, we were way down the list of "number of 1st round draft picks" or "number of NFL players" compared to the other historical powers. Now, we are at the tops of these lists. Again, simply because both coaches approached recruiting in different ways. Neither lacked ability; they were just different.