Offseason Thoughts on The State of The Program

[81usaf92]

As far as the main question…

I think we are as good as we can realistically be. I think people tend to look at things in two ways where they push the panic buttons. 1) This doesn’t look like 2007-2023 and 2) we look unprepared. I think to a degree they are reasonable concerns but ultimately I don’t think they actually answer the question since #1 is unreasonable to obtain and #2 is a flaw that every team in America suffers from at times.

I also don’t see this as a “make or break” season for DeBoer because he is under a massive contract with a huge buyout. So it tells me the powers that be are highly committed to seeing him for atleast 2-3 more years. Also think about Alabama in terms of firing coaches. Aside from Shula… who was the last coach that was actually fired for on the field issues. Yeah you could say Dubose but they were already wanting him gone for some off the field stuff but it’s kind of hard to fire a guy when he wins the SEC the year you want to fire him. Heck even Shula wasn’t truly fired for losing it was more of his unwillingness to fire his OC. My point is we aren’t Auburn in firing everyone after 2-3 years.

I think we may have to be patient because there are alot of things going on that a lot of us don’t really know about. Namely how this staff is trying to navigate through the NIL. There has been a good bit of talk about how this back office is seeking out certain players over recruiting stars to pay massive amounts of money to. It’s why our recruiting looks weak by comparison to others.


DeBoer is probably the guy that wins a national championship when no one expects it and everyone doubts him. I think Harbaugh and Day are probably the best comparisons i could make. I think he will constantly have gripes in the fandom and the media but if he stays long enough i think he will win one.

 

[arthurdawg]

As far as the main question…

I think we are as good as we can realistically be. I think people tend to look at things in two ways where they push the panic buttons. 1) This doesn’t look like 2007-2023 and 2) we look unprepared. I think to a degree they are reasonable concerns but ultimately I don’t think they actually answer the question since #1 is unreasonable to obtain and #2 is a flaw that every team in America suffers from at times.

I also don’t see this as a “make or break” season for DeBoer because he is under a massive contract with a huge buyout. So it tells me the powers that be are highly committed to seeing him for atleast 2-3 more years. Also think about Alabama in terms of firing coaches. Aside from Shula… who was the last coach that was actually fired for on the field issues. Yeah you could say Dubose but they were already wanting him gone for some off the field stuff but it’s kind of hard to fire a guy when he wins the SEC the year you want to fire him. Heck even Shula wasn’t truly fired for losing it was more of his unwillingness to fire his OC. My point is we aren’t Auburn in firing everyone after 2-3 years.

I think we may have to be patient because there are alot of things going on that a lot of us don’t really know about. Namely how this staff is trying to navigate through the NIL. There has been a good bit of talk about how this back office is seeking out certain players over recruiting stars to pay massive amounts of money to. It’s why our recruiting looks weak by comparison to others.


DeBoer is probably the guy that wins a national championship when no one expects it and everyone doubts him. I think Harbaugh and Day are probably the best comparisons i could make. I think he will constantly have gripes in the fandom and the media but if he stays long enough i think he will win one.

What I would try to type if I had the eloquence needed!

That is a very good point, we think we are unique in no longer being Saban Bot level prepared, but this same issue has affected everyone else too. I have watched a couple of Georgia games where they looked lost on the field and Kirbs is as close to Saban as it gets.

And I think that programs firing a coach every 3-4 years over and over are really short sighted in doing that. It really takes 3-4 years (even in the portal era) to build a team, build relationships with high school coaches and recruiting sources, get buy in, etc. So many times that is proceeding and then a team ends up without a couple of dudes they desperately need and out goes the coach and you are back to rebuilding. I just cant see (barring a total collapse on and OFF the field) a situation where not retaining DeBoer for 2-4 more years does us any good whatsoever. He is nowhere near the absolutely awful coaches that Auburn has deperately pulled in over the years. Harsin and Freeze were both terrible fits and total disasters and their own alumni went out the way to damage their program while they were there.

 

[Alasippi2]

My counter to that is that wins don’t necessarily mean a healthy program. Saban was due for a 3-4 loss season with how the internal factors and the discipline slide was going. Many people will argue that but i still maintain that we were just as close to 1-3 plays resulting in a 4 loss season in 23 as we were from a national championship. Bryce in 21 and 22 sometimes single handedly willed us to wins.

Remember the Patriots dynasty died the year they won their last Super Bowl and not when Brady left after 2019. I would argue ours sorta started dying after Tua hit Smitty for a walkoff. Yeah we won another one after that and played for 2 others but we started to see far more compromises made in terms of staff and rosters that we never saw previously.

But ultimately I think the question should be “what CNS would have done in 24 and 25”… TBH… idk especially how 23 actually was going without just looking at Wins and losses

That pretty much sums up what I was saying. Because of N.I.L and the portal, the program wasn't headed in an incredibly positive direction. No one's fault, But like it or not when you change coaches in an almost "must hire a replacement now" fashion It takes an adjustment period and I think Coach D has done a pretty good job in getting us through that period. I do sincerely believe that he will get us back to where we want to be. Time will tell but I'm still confident at this point.

 

[AlexanderFan]

For me personally, it’s a make or break year in how I feel about DeBoer and the direction he can take the program. I feel I have realistic expectations, as I truly feel this is only his second true year at the helm:

I expect the drop in penalties to become the norm, not the exception.

I demand increased physicality at the line of scrimmage ; this will be an ongoing process as the culture must be reestablished, but there has to be solid evidence of movement in the correct direction for me to feel like he can put that standard back in place.

I expect offensive playcalling to have some sort of consistency with regards to sticking with what’s working and staying away from unnecessary drive killing trick plays. I understand these kids need fun, I also understand that to secure players you might need to throw them a bone every now and again, but when it’s time to man up and get the lead I don’t want to see a double reverse flea flicker option fake kneel screen pass to the tackle to do it.

I feel like if those issues are addressed Alabama will consistently find itself in position to win a national championship.

Still going to take some luck.

 

[JDCrimson]

If we were still operating under the Saban landscape of college football I would say this year is the year we need to see some real improvement from Deboer for him to be a viable long term coach.

Since we are not under this same landscape and my passion has waned considerably in the NIL era, im fine with keeping Deboer as long as he will stay. This whole era is predicated less on coaching, and I think he is an excellent coach, than spending enough money to retain a seasoned 2-deep roster and avoid injuries.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

If we were still operating under the Saban landscape of college football I would say this year is the year we need to see some real improvement from Deboer for him to be a viable long term coach.

Since we are not under this same landscape and my passion has waned considerably in the NIL era, im fine with keeping Deboer as long as he will stay. This whole era is predicated less on coaching, and I think he is an excellent coach, than spending enough money to retain a seasoned 2-deep roster and avoid injuries.

I agree with you.

I wonder how many who disagree contribute material dollars to the pay-for-play effort?

 

[Alasippi2]

Way too hard. Comically too hard. Many have been too hard and assigned too much blame.

CNS took over a team ravaged by probation and who finished a season just quitting and losing 5 out of their final 6 games.

What great All-American Award Winning off the shelf players did Shula leave CNS??

I mean give me a break who are kidding with this nonsense revisionist history.

The 1st guy that hit an All-American difference maker level was True Freshman Rolando McClain.

That’s a Saban kid… Saban got that guy… he got a LOT of guys.

(Edit: For 100% accuracy he did inherit Andre Smith who was an FWAA FR All-American in 2006.

He became a Consensus All-American under CNS and won the Outland in 2008.)

There were also a few All-SEC level players that developed further into All-American level players under CNS.

Guys like Caldwell and Rashad Johnson.

The guys he inherited he put through a crucible and either made them better or made them quit and they moved on.

The entire program was Soft and lacked discipline and he had to completely rebuild everything in year 1 and take us from recruiting rankings of barely in the Top 25 most of the time to perennial Top 5 or Higher.

He had an undefeated regular season in Year two and hit a #1 Ranking and gave Meyer and Tebow’s team all they wanted in the SECCG with on paper a much less talented roster.

CKD took over a program who just went 12-2 and won an SEC Championship and lost in a Semifinal OT game to the eventual NC.

There was a lot of guys who left but there was still more talent on paper left over than what rolled into 2007 from Shula. Certainly not less in any shape for or fashion.

There also wasn’t any branding damage. Our image as a program was still close to its zenith. So theoretically that’s one less obstacle in attracting new players to come in addition to being able to take players from the portal as immediate transfers who can immediately play.

It’s the new staffs job to build a roster and Alabama isn’t the only team that’s had to deal with mass roster turnover in the NIL era.

CKD did inherit Proctor, Booker, and #4 who on paper at least were All-SEC or in Proctor’s case a Fr All-American.

The only new addition in 2024 at that level was Ryan Williams.

In 2025 the All-SEC players were Ty, Proctor, Brailsford, Lawson, and Bray.

Only Brailsford is 100% a CKD developed player. I’m not saying the other 4 didn’t grow just that they were inherited players from CNS.

But the lack of accountability towards the new staff for faults and flaws is absolutely astounding.

I don’t like the CNS to CKD comparison to begin with because it’s not 1:1 because the landscape has changed a lot and keeps changing and in addition to that CNS is the GOAT undisputed with a bullet point. Nobody compares.

But nobody wants to allow any kind of comparisons to contemporaries either in the same time frame and circumstances.

Any other Top HC vs CKD is also not allowed and is ‘Unfair’ because most have more tenure at their current school.

If a comparison is made the timeline changes and people pick their early years in a pre nil pre portal era where they are having to slowly build their program through recruiting only and that’s also not 1:1 and a bad faith debate starter.

It’s also not allowed to compare CKD to someone with the same tenure in the same era like Cignetti because “He has an entire team of 29 year old 8th year seniors… Unfair!”

It’s excuse after excuse after excuse, move the goal posts after moving the goalposts, passing the blame after passing the blame.

We are in a situation where the HC is making Top 5 $10 Million money but its simultaneously an apprenticeship ‘learning as he goes’ with an asinine contract with a ridiculous buyout and it’s just okay that it’s that way.

We can’t talk about the pros and cons because of the ‘well who can we replace him with tomorrow’ stipulation which to be completely honest is immaterial to the fact of how well the current job is being done or not done.

How did Tidefans get here?

How is Nick Saban a Villain?

How and why is a guy who averages 4 losses a year and who loses to 5 loss teams as double digit favorites and who gets blown out by 3-4 scores just off limits and above criticism?

All of it to me is just crazy. I’m sorry but it’s crazy.

N.I.L. has changed everything. When N.I.L. came in Saban retired. Why? Because he knew his advantage as an awesome recruiter disappeared to schools that had more payroll. I absolutely hate it, to me it's not the way college sports should be. But until we simply say, "This is Professional Football and we need collective bargaining and salary caps, it's not going to change".

 

[tusks_n_raider]

N.I.L. has changed everything. When N.I.L. came in Saban retired. Why? Because he knew his advantage as an awesome recruiter disappeared to schools that had more payroll. I absolutely hate it, to me it's not the way college sports should be. But until we simply say, "This is Professional Football and we need collective bargaining and salary caps, it's not going to change".

I don’t know that he retired because he thought his advantage went away.

I haven’t seen or heard him say that. Maybe he did and I missed it.

What I remember him addressing was players being more concerned about their pay and what they could get than any personal or team goals.

In any case I’ll ask a question for the entire board and anyone who wants to give an opinion please do so.

Who is it fair to compare CKD to?

 

[81usaf92]

Way too hard. Comically too hard. Many have been too hard and assigned too much blame.

CNS took over a team ravaged by probation and who finished a season just quitting and losing 5 out of their final 6 games.

What great All-American Award Winning off the shelf players did Shula leave CNS??

I mean give me a break who are kidding with this nonsense revisionist history.

The 1st guy that hit an All-American difference maker level was True Freshman Rolando McClain.

That’s a Saban kid… Saban got that guy… he got a LOT of guys.

(Edit: For 100% accuracy he did inherit Andre Smith who was an FWAA FR All-American in 2006.

He became a Consensus All-American under CNS and won the Outland in 2008.)

There were also a few All-SEC level players that developed further into All-American level players under CNS.

Guys like Caldwell and Rashad Johnson.

The guys he inherited he put through a crucible and either made them better or made them quit and they moved on.

The entire program was Soft and lacked discipline and he had to completely rebuild everything in year 1 and take us from recruiting rankings of barely in the Top 25 most of the time to perennial Top 5 or Higher.

He had an undefeated regular season in Year two and hit a #1 Ranking and gave Meyer and Tebow’s team all they wanted in the SECCG with on paper a much less talented roster.

CKD took over a program who just went 12-2 and won an SEC Championship and lost in a Semifinal OT game to the eventual NC.

There was a lot of guys who left but there was still more talent on paper left over than what rolled into 2007 from Shula. Certainly not less in any shape for or fashion.

There also wasn’t any branding damage. Our image as a program was still close to its zenith. So theoretically that’s one less obstacle in attracting new players to come in addition to being able to take players from the portal as immediate transfers who can immediately play.

It’s the new staffs job to build a roster and Alabama isn’t the only team that’s had to deal with mass roster turnover in the NIL era.

CKD did inherit Proctor, Booker, and #4 who on paper at least were All-SEC or in Proctor’s case a Fr All-American.

The only new addition in 2024 at that level was Ryan Williams.

In 2025 the All-SEC players were Ty, Proctor, Brailsford, Lawson, and Bray.

Only Brailsford is 100% a CKD developed player. I’m not saying the other 4 didn’t grow just that they were inherited players from CNS.

But the lack of accountability towards the new staff for faults and flaws is absolutely astounding.

I don’t like the CNS to CKD comparison to begin with because it’s not 1:1 because the landscape has changed a lot and keeps changing and in addition to that CNS is the GOAT undisputed with a bullet point. Nobody compares.

But nobody wants to allow any kind of comparisons to contemporaries either in the same time frame and circumstances.

Any other Top HC vs CKD is also not allowed and is ‘Unfair’ because most have more tenure at their current school.

If a comparison is made the timeline changes and people pick their early years in a pre nil pre portal era where they are having to slowly build their program through recruiting only and that’s also not 1:1 and a bad faith debate starter.

It’s also not allowed to compare CKD to someone with the same tenure in the same era like Cignetti because “He has an entire team of 29 year old 8th year seniors… Unfair!”

It’s excuse after excuse after excuse, move the goal posts after moving the goalposts, passing the blame after passing the blame.

We are in a situation where the HC is making Top 5 $10 Million money but its simultaneously an apprenticeship ‘learning as he goes’ with an asinine contract with a ridiculous buyout and it’s just okay that it’s that way.

We can’t talk about the pros and cons because of the ‘well who can we replace him with tomorrow’ stipulation which to be completely honest is immaterial to the fact of how well the current job is being done or not done.

How did Tidefans get here?

How is Nick Saban a Villain?

How and why is a guy who averages 4 losses a year and who loses to 5 loss teams as double digit favorites and who gets blown out by 3-4 scores just off limits and above criticism?

All of it to me is just crazy. I’m sorry but it’s crazy.

Alright if you want to compare him to Cignitti go ahead. But also be sure to include expectations at the program, competition of schedules, non revolving rosters, size of individual donors, and conference depth. It gets alot murkier when you factor in off the field stuff.

I think if you want a good comparison go with Ryan Day and Harbaugh. 95% of this board constantly questioned why they weren’t fired and why their programs kept hanging onto them after bad losses. Yet none of those early criticisms are valid anymore are they…. I think in the new era of football you have to be a lot more patient and can’t always flip on a dime because something works for one year for one specific program…. Better way of putting this… who is going to win more championships between Day and Cignitti in the next 5 years

 

[bamacpa]

The reality is we cannot outbid much larger schools with much larger alumni fanbases on the overall roster. I like the approach we're taking of paying for retention but the days of entering every single November with championship hopes intact are over for us. We've had as many dominant runs as any program. I think we've got to give this staff 5 years or more before grading them...and grading on a scale very different than the Saban, Stallings, or Bryant scales.

 

[BAMARICH]

The reality is we cannot outbid much larger schools with much larger alumni fanbases on the overall roster. I like the approach we're taking of paying for retention but the days of entering every single November with championship hopes intact are over for us. We've had as many dominant runs as any program. I think we've got to give this staff 5 years or more before grading them...and grading on a scale very different than the Saban, Stallings, or Bryant scales.

Lot of truth in this post IMO. Adjusting expectations is extremely difficult. Not only does it show up in recruiting rankings, but it also shows up in win-lose expectations, coaching availability (as in, who else could we get???), player retention, and a host of other things.

 

[NoNC4Tubs]

N.I.L. has changed everything. When N.I.L. came in Saban retired. Why? Because he knew his advantage as an awesome recruiter disappeared to schools that had more payroll. I absolutely hate it, to me it's not the way college sports should be. But until we simply say, "This is Professional Football and we need collective bargaining and salary caps, it's not going to change".

Are you Coach Saban posting under an anonymous monicker?

 

[Coach D]

Don’t think it’s a make or break year in that he will get fired unless something really bad happens. Think even 7 wins his seat turns warm as far as the AD is concerned. Certain things look better this past year and some really needed coaching changes happened so another positive and the program seems on the up swing again. However, the fact that he is an offensive coach and we have had two of the worst offenses I’ve seen at Bama under him is still a huge flag. Defense bailed the team out last year huge. So I agree with others that it’s not make or break but I do think we see if he really is a good offensive mind or not and if he is purely a CEO type guy. I think we will see his coaching ability or if there is a lack of and dependency on coordinators. Lot of positives from him/staff but also huge flags offensively.

 

[Alasippi2]

Are you Coach Saban posting under an anonymous monicker?

Sometimes I feel like it

 

[tusks_n_raider]

Alright if you want to compare him to Cignitti go ahead. But also be sure to include expectations at the program, competition of schedules, non revolving rosters, size of individual donors, and conference depth. It gets alot murkier when you factor in off the field stuff.

I think if you want a good comparison go with Ryan Day and Harbaugh. 95% of this board constantly questioned why they weren’t fired and why their programs kept hanging onto them after bad losses. Yet none of those early criticisms are valid anymore are they…. I think in the new era of football you have to be a lot more patient and can’t always flip on a dime because something works for one year for one specific program…. Better way of putting this… who is going to win more championships between Day and Cignitti in the next 5 years

I can only go by reported estimates wrt NIL and Alabama and Indiana had virtually the same reported estimates for NIL in both 2024 and 2025.

Maybe there is some extra off the books monies but how do we prove or disprove that?

Indiana portaled out 23 players in 2023, 36 players in 2024, and 42 in 2025 so they do in fact deal with a revolving roster like everyone else.

There has been a difference in SOS but the gap has been closing.

Indiana had an SOS of 35 in 2024 which is not weak really and in 2025 it was 10 which is pretty tough.

So just speaking for me that picture isn’t really murky it’s pretty clear.

I’m in the 5% for Ryan Day because I’ve repeatedly defended him in the past and said people were overreacting wrt to wanting him fired.

The only time I wavered was his NC year when he inexplicably lost to a mediocre to bad Mich team before they went on a Title run. He definitely had or has a Mich problem like how Kirby had a CNS problem.

But for the most part Day picked up right where Meyer left off.



He started off 34-4 in his 1st 3 full seasons + the part where he took over the year before.

He’s never lost more than 2 games in a season and for the most part even though people were frustrated with almost breaking through he didn’t suffer many outright bad losses.

2019 - Lost to Clemson in a Semi by 6
2020 - Lost big to Us in the NCG but so did almost everyone that year
2021 - Lost to #12 Oregon by 7 & Lost to #5 Mich by 15 (2 Score Loss)
2022 - Lost to #3 Mich by 18 (3 Score Loss - Bad) & lost by 1 on a Missed FG to eventual NC UGA
2023 - Lost by 6 to #3 Mich and by 11 to # 9 Mizzou (2 Scores)
2024 - Lost to #3 Oregon by 1 and lost to a mediocre to bad Mich by 3 (Horrible Loss) then won the NC
2025 - Lost to #2 and Eventual NC IU by 3 and lost to #10 NCG RU Miami by 10 (2 Scores)

The man definitely has had a Michigan problem.

But by my count he’s had 6 ‘Bad losses’ in 7+ Seasons but he’s also finished in the Top 5 Six times and won 3 Conference Titles (Two in a row to start his tenure) and a NC, a NCG appearance, and Multiple Semi Finals.

One could argue that CKD compares even worse to Day than even CNS or Cignetti.

Harbaugh is probably the best comparison I’ve seen floated but that’s maybe not 1:1 either because his run was almost entirely before the NIL/Portal era and he took over for Brady Hoke who in the 2 years prior had records of 7-6 and 5-7 so Harbaugh had to do a bit of rebuilding.

His 1st two Seasons he was 20-6 and that’s on paper in the ball park I suppose but he also only had 1 really inexplicably bad loss.

2015 - Lost to Utah 24-17, Lost to #7 Mich State 27-24, and was Hammered by #8 tOSU 42-13

2016 - Lost to Iowa 14-13, Lost to #2 tOSU in Double OT 30-27, and Lost to #11 FSU 33-32

As I look at all that CKD has had more inexplicably bad losses already than those 9 seasons combined of Day and Harbaugh.

As to your final question of Day vs Cignetti I’m not sure who will fare better in the next few years but it looks like it’s going to be the new premier rivalry in the B1G and maybe all of CFB.

Thank you for putting a few names out there for comparison.

 

[81usaf92]

I can only go buy reported estimates wrt NIL and Alabama and Indiana had virtually the same reported estimates for NIL in both 2024 and 2025.

Maybe there is some extra off the books monies but how do we prove or disprove that?

Indiana portaled out 23 players in 2023, 36 players in 2024, and 42 in 2025 so they do in fact deal with a revolving roster like everyone else.

There has been a difference in SOS but the gap has been closing.

Indiana had an SOS of 35 in 2024 which is not weak really and in 2025 it was 10 which is pretty tough.

So just speaking for me that picture isn’t really murky it’s pretty clear.

I’m in the 5% for Ryan Day because I’ve repeatedly defended him in the past and said people were overreacting wrt to wanting him fired.

The only time I wavered was his NC year when he inexplicably lost to a mediocre to bad Mich team before they went on a Title run. He definitely had or has a Mich problem like how Kirby had a CNS problem.

But for the most part Day picked up right where Meyer left off.

View attachment 57977

He started off 34-4 in his 1st 3 full seasons + the part where he took over the year before.

He’s never lost more than 2 games in a season and for the most part even though people were frustrated with almost breaking through he didn’t suffer many outright bad losses.

2019 - Lost to Clemson in a Semi by 6
2020 - Lost big to Us in the NCG but so did almost everyone that year
2021 - Lost to #12 Oregon by 7 & Lost to #5 Mich by 15 (2 Score Loss)
2022 - Lost to #3 Mich by 18 (3 Score Loss - Bad) & lost by 1 on a Missed FG to eventual NC UGA
2023 - Lost by 6 to #3 Mich and by 11 to # 9 Mizzou (2 Scores)
2024 - Lost to #3 Oregon by 1 and lost to a mediocre to bad Mich by 3 (Horrible Loss) then won the NC
2025 - Lost to #2 and Eventual NC IU by 3 and lost to #10 NCG RU Miami by 10 (2 Scores)

The man definitely has had a Michigan problem.

But by my count he’s had 6 ‘Bad losses’ in 7+ Seasons but he’s also finished in the Top 5 Six times and won 3 Conference Titles (Two in a row to start his tenure) and a NC, a NCG appearance, and Multiple Semi Finals.

One could argue that CKD compares even worse to Day than even CNS or Cignetti.

Harbaugh is probably the best comparison I’ve seen floated but that’s maybe not 1:1 either because his run was almost entirely before the NIL/Portal era and he took over for Brady Hoke who in the 2 years prior had records of 7-6 and 5-7 so Harbaugh had to do a bit of rebuilding.

His 1st two Seasons he was 20-6 and that’s on paper in the ball park I suppose but he also only had 1 really inexplicably bad loss.

2015 - Lost to Utah 24-17, Lost to #7 Mich State 27-24, and was Hammered by #8 tOSU 42-13

2016 - Lost to Iowa 14-13, Lost to #2 tOSU in Double OT 30-27, and Lost to #11 FSU 33-32

As I look at all that CKD has had more inexplicably bad losses already than those 9 seasons combined of Day and Harbaugh.

As to your final question of Day vs Cignetti I’m not sure who will fare better in the next few years but it looks like it’s going to be the new premier rivalry in the B1G and maybe all of CFB.

Thank you for putting a few names out there for comparison.

I think my point was more about “feel” vs “actual” state of the program. Day and Harbaugh had strong nucleus in their teams but they would always lose that game that they shouldn’t. DeBoer tends to lose them badly but he also tends to win games where no one really gives Alabama the benefit of the doubt too. If we are being completely honest the only two games that he has lost that makes absolutely no sense are FSU and Oklahoma with Arnold, aside from that you are talking about him losing to 3 playoff teams and Vandy. I still think too many people are more overly harsh on Vandy because it’s Vandy and don’t want to admit that it was a far more quality opponent than what it is.

Yeah and before someone says it he lost to a bad Michigan team but i really don’t want to bring up the elephant in the room there. So let’s just ignore it.

I think what I’m really getting at is that we have to think about this new era of college football like MLB franchises. There are rich teams, mid teams, and poor teams in terms of spending power. We are clearly in the upper middle. I think with that said we have really two choices… 1) do like LSU just did and spend everything they had all at once or 2) get players that we want and save the war chest. I think we are married to the latter because we want to keep consistency. With that said you need a consistent figure head at top and we have to be a little more open to some losses than what we were because everyone else is going to have talented rosters. We are basically copying the Lea formula on a larger scale and saying down the line it’s going to pay off. Specific wins and losses and specific seasons don’t mean as much in evaluating a coach as how far you make it in the playoffs. Unless you have resources like Sark and Cristobal… firing a coach probably shouldn’t start with “this guy lost to Vandy and a bad FSU team in week 1 on the road” they probably should start with “can this guy get us the semis and beyond in the next 3-4 years”

 

[CoolBreeze]

The reality is we cannot outbid much larger schools with much larger alumni fanbases on the overall roster. I like the approach we're taking of paying for retention but the days of entering every single November with championship hopes intact are over for us. We've had as many dominant runs as any program. I think we've got to give this staff 5 years or more before grading them...and grading on a scale very different than the Saban, Stallings, or Bryant scales.

Jewel of a post and great conversation in this thread. We have no choice but to temper our expectations in this environment. That starts by understanding that what has evolved into today's reality is because of our success. Taking the sport to cold hard cash was the only way to loosen the grip of Southern Football. The only way forward for us is through an intelligent approach and to work it diligently. Gonna loose a lot of fair weather fans over the coming years but that is ok. Will be interesting when the likes of Texas Tech or SMU win back to back championships. Maybe then things will change but until that day all we can do is root for our boys and keep up the conversation. Pretty intelligent fan base in these parts.

 

[Joefus]

We got a punchers chance the next two seasons and that’s nothing to sneeze at. If it stays a money game that’s really all we can hope for. Similar to what a lot of the baseball fans post on here about small market teams etc. Barring an 8 or more loss season he’s not going anywhere anytime soon so this is his chance to really take his shot. The new 5 year thing is really gonna make things interesting next season

 

[NoNC4Tubs]

Don’t think it’s a make or break year in that he will get fired unless something really bad happens. Think even 7 wins his seat turns warm as far as the AD is concerned. Certain things look better this past year and some really needed coaching changes happened so another positive and the program seems on the up swing again. However, the fact that he is an offensive coach and we have had two of the worst offenses I’ve seen at Bama under him is still a huge flag. Defense bailed the team out last year huge. So I agree with others that it’s not make or break but I do think we see if he really is a good offensive mind or not and if he is purely a CEO type guy. I think we will see his coaching ability or if there is a lack of and dependency on coordinators. Lot of positives from him/staff but also huge flags offensively.

We had a horrible QB the first year that wasn't even his guy...

Last year the OL was a hot mess.

 

[Coach D]

We had a horrible QB the first year that wasn't even his guy...

Last year the OL was a hot mess.

Can always have excuses. The same QB did better year before then did worse. His QB didn’t beat anyone on the roster. OL was probably worst Bama oline I’ve ever seen. I’ve given him credit for the positive. But can also point out when a team is historically bad on the side the head coach is supposed to be good at then It’s a flag. But also why I said this year we will know how he is.