Question: Anyone Have Any Combine News????

[BEATtutorsee]

I was very happy to see Kareem's time, he certainly helped himself an awful lot.

 

[bamabryan]

I was very happy to see Kareem's time, he certainly helped himself an awful lot.

I heard today (cannot remember who said it) that Kareem has a great shot to go in the top 40 in the draft. If this is the case I owe Kareem an apology. I did not see him going before the third round at best and I thought there was a pretty fair shot that he would not go until the fourth round.

 

[CapstoneGrad06]

I heard today (cannot remember who said it) that Kareem has a great shot to go in the top 40 in the draft. If this is the case I owe Kareem an apology. I did not see him going before the third round at best and I thought there was a pretty fair shot that he would not go until the fourth round.

There is talk of late first round, early second round fro KJ.

 

[Rasputin]

His coverage deficiencies are overplayed. He's definitely not weak in coverage; that's just lazy scouts assuming his relatively low INT total demonstrates some flaw in his game.

I've got to admit, I didn't think he'd even get into the 4.4's, so even that lowered time of 4.43 is impressive to me (or, as impressive as a forty time can be). He's definitely approaching Calvin Johnson on the physical freak scale.

This is a prime example of someone being a paper champion Vs. a football player...

Taylor Mays Vs. Rolando McClain

Some teams will draft players based on there measurables while others will draft based on their game film...

I prefer the latter!

I'll give an example, I played college football with an athlete that was 6-6 280 and ran a 4.6 (NFL timed). This guy on paper is an all-pro type player, yet he never even made all conference in our Division II conference. He has bounced around from NFL scout team to NFL scout team for the last 5 years or so and makes good money out of it, but he is just not a "football player"...

I'm not saying Taylor Mays won't ever start in the NFL, but Taylor Mays' measurables far outweigh his immeasurables!

He takes bad angles and has very little football "instinct". Things of this nature, if they haven't been taught by now, they never will be. I mean for dang sake's he was coached by Pete Carrol and a great staff at USCW!

 

[rgw]

Kareem seems to have solidified himself as a possible late first round pick. I really didn't expect that in January to be quite honest. Looks like he made a great decision to leave though I thought otherwise.

 

[bamabryan]

I still have a hard time seeing KJ going in the first round, but he's already made a liar out of me because I thought he made a huge mistake in leaving a year early. It would certainly appear that he will have no problem at all going in the second round. Congratulations to Kareem. I'm very happy for him.

 

[RollTide1224]

This is a prime example of someone being a paper champion Vs. a football player...

Taylor Mays Vs. Rolando McClain

Some teams will draft players based on there measurables while others will draft based on their game film...

I prefer the latter!

I'll give an example, I played college football with an athlete that was 6-6 280 and ran a 4.6 (NFL timed). This guy on paper is an all-pro type player, yet he never even made all conference in our Division II conference. He has bounced around from NFL scout team to NFL scout team for the last 5 years or so and makes good money out of it, but he is just not a "football player"...

I'm not saying Taylor Mays won't ever start in the NFL, but Taylor Mays' measurables far outweigh his immeasurables!

He takes bad angles and has very little football "instinct". Things of this nature, if they haven't been taught by now, they never will be. I mean for dang sake's he was coached by Pete Carrol and a great staff at USCW!

Taylor Mays was a three time first team all american. I don't think people are just excited because he ran a fast 40 time. I think Darius Heyward Bey is a better example of good 40 time not good football player. I have enough faith in the AP that someone who gets voted 3 time all american is a pretty good football player.

The only knock I have heard on him is he goes for the hit before the interception, but physically he is amazing and was an incredible college player. Last year if he had come out early everyone thought he was a top 5 pick. Then idiots like McShay say that he won't run a fast 40 and has dropped out of the first round (he actually said that around senior bowl time). Mays should have all along been considered a first round pick guys with his physical ability and success in college should go in the first round no doubt.

I really dislike Todd McShay by the way he was trashing Cody after the senior bowl saying he is a 3rd round pick maybe even into the 4th. I can't believe he actually thought there are over 100 players better than Cody in the draft. Kiper all along has said Cody is first round maybe early second round. If I were an NFL GM anyone who is a two or three time all american would be more than welcome on my team. How can you win those awards and not be a great football player.

 

[Harmost]

This is a prime example of someone being a paper champion Vs. a football player...

Taylor Mays Vs. Rolando McClain

Some teams will draft players based on there measurables while others will draft based on their game film...

I prefer the latter!

I'll give an example, I played college football with an athlete that was 6-6 280 and ran a 4.6 (NFL timed). This guy on paper is an all-pro type player, yet he never even made all conference in our Division II conference. He has bounced around from NFL scout team to NFL scout team for the last 5 years or so and makes good money out of it, but he is just not a "football player"...

I'm not saying Taylor Mays won't ever start in the NFL, but Taylor Mays' measurables far outweigh his immeasurables!

He takes bad angles and has very little football "instinct". Things of this nature, if they haven't been taught by now, they never will be. I mean for dang sake's he was coached by Pete Carrol and a great staff at USCW!

As I said before, that bit is overplayed. He gets to the ball/ballcarrier exceptionally well I think, and has phenomenal timing on the hit; he isn't slow to react and isn't confused. He produces. I'm sure he could be found taking the occasional bad angle or what have you, but so could Berry et al.

 

[Nolan]

I really dislike Todd McShay by the way he was trashing Cody after the senior bowl saying he is a 3rd round pick maybe even into the 4th. I can't believe he actually thought there are over 100 players better than Cody in the draft. Kiper all along has said Cody is first round maybe early second round. If I were an NFL GM anyone who is a two or three time all american would be more than welcome on my team. How can you win those awards and not be a great football player.

Good point... and as for Mays, well, I would take Eric Berry before him anyday but if the USC safety slips to around the 10th-12th pick and you need athleticism in your back seven, you gotta take him. I have seen more questionable picks than that. But who knows, it's the NFL, and they're full of "experts."

 

[BEATtutorsee]

I heard today (cannot remember who said it) that Kareem has a great shot to go in the top 40 in the draft. If this is the case I owe Kareem an apology. I did not see him going before the third round at best and I thought there was a pretty fair shot that he would not go until the fourth round.

I believe he has a very good shot at going in the second round, which would probably be as high as he would go (this year or had he returned for his senior year). JMHO. I never had a problem with his decision, and with the 40 time he turned in it certainly looks as if he made the right decision.

 

[RTR91]

In regards to KJ, Todd McShay said today on Sportscenter that he probably raised his stock the most this week. He went onto say that he figures late First Round to teams looking for a CB like New England (there is a connection ther), Baltimore (good defense), and Atlanta. McShay also said he thinks KJ was the best coverage guy on this past year's team.

Bama will have anywhere 1 to 3 players drafted in the first round. Ro will be Top 10 or Top 15. Cody might go in the first along with KJ.

 

[IH8Orange]

I'd like to see a statistic on how many plays in an NFL game involve a player running 40 yards in a straight line.

I assume it would be pretty low.

If I were evaluating players, I'd give little weight to the 40 times and focus on the shuttle times. I believe that 0 to 10 yard acceleration and the ability to change direction are immensely more important than the speed over a long distance.

 

[Rasputin]

Taylor Mays was a three time first team all american. I don't think people are just excited because he ran a fast 40 time. I think Darius Heyward Bey is a better example of good 40 time not good football player. I have enough faith in the AP that someone who gets voted 3 time all american is a pretty good football player.

The only knock I have heard on him is he goes for the hit before the interception, but physically he is amazing and was an incredible college player. Last year if he had come out early everyone thought he was a top 5 pick. Then idiots like McShay say that he won't run a fast 40 and has dropped out of the first round (he actually said that around senior bowl time). Mays should have all along been considered a first round pick guys with his physical ability and success in college should go in the first round no doubt.

I really dislike Todd McShay by the way he was trashing Cody after the senior bowl saying he is a 3rd round pick maybe even into the 4th. I can't believe he actually thought there are over 100 players better than Cody in the draft. Kiper all along has said Cody is first round maybe early second round. If I were an NFL GM anyone who is a two or three time all american would be more than welcome on my team. How can you win those awards and not be a great football player.

As I said before, that bit is overplayed. He gets to the ball/ballcarrier exceptionally well I think, and has phenomenal timing on the hit; he isn't slow to react and isn't confused. He produces. I'm sure he could be found taking the occasional bad angle or what have you, but so could Berry et al.

I'm not questioning that Mays was a good college player, imo he was overrated grossly though. I watched alot of USC games and, especially this year, there defense was below average. Mays played with little emotion and at times looked lost.

He no doubt will probably be a long time NFL player, but to me, I don't feel he is the next Sean Taylor like some try to make him out to be...

 

[stlimprov]

I'd like to see a statistic on how many plays in an NFL game involve a player running 40 yards in a straight line.

I assume it would be pretty low.

If I were evaluating players, I'd give little weight to the 40 times and focus on the shuttle times. I believe that 0 to 10 yard acceleration and the ability to change direction are immensely more important than the speed over a long distance.

If I'm not mistaken, the fascination with 40 time started with Paul Brown, who found that it correlated what he wanted in wide receivers. There are about about a million reasons one could argue that 40 time has long since jumped the shark. That we even measure 40 time for guards, for example, would tend to prove he point that it's use has long since surpassed understanding of it's utility.

But folks have got to chatter about something, right?

 

[bamacon]

I'd like to see a statistic on how many plays in an NFL game involve a player running 40 yards in a straight line.

I assume it would be pretty low.

If I were evaluating players, I'd give little weight to the 40 times and focus on the shuttle times. I believe that 0 to 10 yard acceleration and the ability to change direction are immensely more important than the speed over a long distance.

Recovery speed for DBs is critical. That is why KJ's stock went up (way up) with his 40 times. These scouts know what it takes to play in the NFL and speed is super critical at a lot of positions. It is not everything but it is a major factor.

 

[IH8Orange]

Recovery speed for DBs is critical. That is why KJ's stock went up (way up) with his 40 times. These scouts know what it takes to play in the NFL and speed is super critical at a lot of positions. It is not everything but it is a major factor.

The first step (and the most important step IMO) to recovery is acceleration. Acceleration is a change in velocity (vector field = speed + direction) and if a player is having to recover, he is having to accelerate. If he's moving in the wrong direction, then he has to both change direction, determine a trajectory that puts him on target and then accelerate toward the point of intersection. If he's already moving in the correct direction, then he has to accelerate toward the point of intersection.

Forty times aren't always indicative of how fast a player can accelerate through the first few yards. Some players start slowly, but continue to build momentum over almost the entire 40 yards. Some players reach maximum speed faster but may not be as fast as the other players over the last few yards.

If a DB gets out of position on a long pattern, having that great 40 speed might be more important than the shuttle speed, but I'd venture that on the vast majority of plays, the shuttle speed is more important. It might be said that a DB with great shuttle speed isn't as likely to need recovery speed.

It would be time consuming, but having a 10-yard and 20-yard dash to compliment the 40-yard would give a much better indication of the acceleration ability of a player.

 

[IH8Orange]

But folks have got to chatter about something, right?

We've always got orange hats to talk about. :biggrin2:

 

[BAMAHD]

ESPN having a little fun at the NFL combine. Rich Eisens 40 Yard Dash with Cody and Jacoby Ford.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU_3encGVP4]YouTube - Rich Eisens 40 Yard Dash at NFL Combine 2010[/ame]

 

[TIDE-HSV]

The first step (and the most important step IMO) to recovery is acceleration. Acceleration is a change in velocity (vector field = speed + direction) and if a player is having to recover, he is having to accelerate. If he's moving in the wrong direction, then he has to both change direction, determine a trajectory that puts him on target and then accelerate toward the point of intersection. If he's already moving in the correct direction, then he has to accelerate toward the point of intersection.

Forty times aren't always indicative of how fast a player can accelerate through the first few yards. Some players start slowly, but continue to build momentum over almost the entire 40 yards. Some players reach maximum speed faster but may not be as fast as the other players over the last few yards.

If a DB gets out of position on a long pattern, having that great 40 speed might be more important than the shuttle speed, but I'd venture that on the vast majority of plays, the shuttle speed is more important. It might be said that a DB with great shuttle speed isn't as likely to need recovery speed.

It would be time consuming, but having a 10-yard and 20-yard dash to compliment the 40-yard would give a much better indication of the acceleration ability of a player.

Good analysis, IH8. I saw that at work when Trent broke away for his TD against UTw. Their safety bit, the corners were up and, Trent is so fast, they made a wrong judgment on their angles, if indeed they ever had a workable angle. By the time the truth became apparent, their effort looked pretty futile. He gained on them all the way to the EZ. All the while Muschamp was on the sideline making a tomahawk gesture and you could read his lips screaming "There's no way he can be that fast!"

 

[mittman]

ESPN having a little fun at the NFL combine. Rich Eisens 40 Yard Dash with Cody and Jacoby Ford.

YouTube - Rich Eisens 40 Yard Dash at NFL Combine 2010

Classic :biggrin: