Coaching changes in full motion.

CrimsonTitles

All-SEC
Mar 30, 2015
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One could make the argument that had Auburn not hired Pearl, maybe Alabama wouldn't have hired CNO. I shudder at that thought - I want all of the Alabama's programs to be successful and fully funded to be successful, but it's possible alternative outcome.
I've seen people make that argument, but I don't agree with that all. That rhetoric would only make sense if he were already proven when we hired him, but Oats was not Nate Oats when we hired him. He was a promising midmajor coach just like all the rest. We struck gold is all. We hired Anthony Grant thinking he was going to be the next big thing also. I remember all the talk about him basically being the next Billy Donovan. Then the next time we tried to hire a coach we went all in on Gregg Marshall, but he ended up ultimately staying in Wichita. We'd been trying to find a great basketball coach for years even before Pearl was at Auburn. I was actually disappointed when we hired Oats, because I had no idea who he was, and I wanted Thad Matta. I'm so glad we hired Oats instead.
 
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Crimson1967

Hall of Fame
Nov 22, 2011
19,496
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Speaking of guys who were supposed to be great I just saw that Central Michigan fired Tony Barbee. Amazingly, his record there of 49-75 was the exact same mark he posted at the barn.
 

jjv0004

All-SEC
Dec 13, 2017
1,125
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Greenville, SC
I'm not saying you are wrong. But I am curious where you are getting this from because it's the first time I've heard CNO is not happy at Alabama.

As a matter of fact, I watched his post game PC after the Duke game and I got the impression that he's more driven, focused and personally committed to bringing a NC to Bama than he's ever been! IOW, he didn't sound like a guy looking to leave.

All it would take is for his agent to float out he's unhappy and he'd be getting phone calls from top programs immediately.

KY wanted to hire him. Supposedly, Texas wanted to hire him. I'd bet UNC would fire their coach and hire him immediately.

FWIW, I know nothing, but I know he's one of, if not, the hottest coaches in college basketball. Seems like if he's unhappy we'd be seeing his tail lights already.
I am clearly not going to divulge where I get my information from but it is legit.
 

lowend

All-SEC
Feb 20, 2005
1,461
1,388
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You need to worry about more than the NBA. Oats is not happy with Bama right now. He had to beg for a salary bump for Murphy and he does not like how much of our NIL goes to football.
Is a basketball coach ever happy with what football gets? Every basketball coach I've ever met has a chip on their shoulder about it. He's an intelligent guy and he came to the wrong school if he wasn't comfortable with football driving the bus at Bama.
 
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BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
Apr 1, 2004
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I am clearly not going to divulge where I get my information from but it is legit.
I respect that. I know you don't burn good sources.

I don't like the sounds of it, but I also like the resolve that CNO is showing.

Perhaps he "shows" how important it is/should be if he can leverage the roster it'll take to win a NC.

Knowing nothing of any inside knowledge, my fear would be he gets impatient with slowly climbing the mountain as he's doing at Bama and bolts for a blue blood that will help him buy that roster.

I think we all believe he's got a vision for championships. Just hope we can hold on to him.
 

imauafan

All-American
Mar 3, 2004
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Huntsville, AL
I've seen people make that argument, but I don't agree with that all. That rhetoric would only make sense if he were already proven when we hired him, but Oats was not Nate Oats when we hired him. He was a promising midmajor coach just like all the rest. We struck gold is all. We hired Anthony Grant thinking he was going to be the next big thing also. I remember all the talk about him basically being the next Billy Donovan. Then the next time we tried to hire a coach we went all in on Gregg Marshall, but he ended up ultimately staying in Wichita. We'd been trying to find a great basketball coach for years even before Pearl was at Auburn. I was actually disappointed when we hired Oats, because I had no idea who he was, and I wanted Thad Matta. I'm so glad we hired Oats instead.
You are absolutely 100% correct. AU likes to think that we react to moves they make but that is not true nor has it ever been true. I have some very close friends who are die-hard AU fans and when they say this, I have to bite my tongue.

With the exception of David Hobbs, we've always gone after and usually hired some of the highest sought-after coaches we could get. Hiring the top assistant of the previous successful coach had worked with Wimp but not with Hobbs. We hired CNO because xCAJ did not work out. We hired xCAJ because xCAG did not work out. Both men lost interest and were looking for the first bus out of town. You could see it in their body language on the sideline. I don't think xCAG ever truly bought in because he did absolutely nothing to promote the program. We did them a favor by firing them so that they could get their buyout. The reports were that xCAG had pursued the Illinois job after only a year or two at Bama.

The truth is Bama basketball has historically been #2 in the SEC, and we've had brief periods of time where we were the class of the SEC (e.g. mid-to-late 80's). AU has had some successful moments with their basketball program, but they always revert back to the mean.
 
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BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
Apr 1, 2004
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Boone, NC
Excited for Bucky. I want to root for him but not for TAMU!

TAMU, in major sports, seems to always do less with more than any school I've ever seen!
 
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Crimson1967

Hall of Fame
Nov 22, 2011
19,496
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The post-Wimp era has had its highs and lows. Hobbs never really got it going beyond mediocrity. Gottfried got to the Elite Eight but that was about it and fell apart.

Grant seemed to have it together. No postseason his first year. Then the NIT finals and then losing the 8/9 game in the NCAA. But that was the end of his improvement and was gone four years later. Seems to have done well at Dayton, had a very good team when COVID shut things down. Glad he has found success.

Avery Johnson was just a failure and a bad hire. Had one tournament team thanks to Sexton.

Oats is clearly the best of the bunch. If he is unhappy I don’t know what it takes. He certainly knew he would be second fiddle to football if he came here. I hope we can keep him but if a blue blood comes calling he may be gone.
 

BAMAVILLE

Moderator (FB,BB,REC)
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Jan 9, 2014
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Until we have something official about him wanting to leave, I wouldn't read too much about talks of CNO being unhappy. I would bet that CNS was unhappy about several things every year he was here lol

Saying that to say that all coaches have something to gripe about ... the question is if it's enough for that coach to be somewhere else. And until we hear different, we are good.
 

Bpilktree

All-SEC
Jan 7, 2019
1,133
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How is Maryland a better place for him to go?
On ESPN they were talking about Buzz going to Maryland and was it a better choice. Seth said that he heard from a very very reliable source at A&M that Buzz and AD Trev Albert’s had only spoken 1 time in the last year and that Trev only cared about the football program. If that is true that makes sense why he wanted out of there.
 
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4Q Basket Case

FB|BB Moderator
Staff member
Nov 8, 2004
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You need to worry about more than the NBA. Oats is not happy with Bama right now. He had to beg for a salary bump for Murphy and he does not like how much of our NIL goes to football.

Kansas is the one to watch. When Bill Self gets tired of losing like this year, he will be gone.
I'm not saying you are wrong. But I am curious where you are getting this from because it's the first time I've heard CNO is not happy at Alabama.

As a matter of fact, I watched his post game PC after the Duke game and I got the impression that he's more driven, focused and personally committed to bringing a NC to Bama than he's ever been! IOW, he didn't sound like a guy looking to leave.

All it would take is for his agent to float out he's unhappy and he'd be getting phone calls from top programs immediately.

KY wanted to hire him. Supposedly, Texas wanted to hire him. I'd bet UNC would fire their coach and hire him immediately.

FWIW, I know nothing, but I know he's one of, if not, the hottest coaches in college basketball. Seems like if he's unhappy we'd be seeing his tail lights already.
I am clearly not going to divulge where I get my information from but it is legit.
Good move not divulging good sources. Takes years or decades to build them. But the tap of an 'Enter' key can destroy them forever and trash your name amongst other good sources -- there aren't that many of them, and they tend to know each other.

Regarding Oats, I actually think you're both right. I've heard some rumblings about Oats' disappointment with basketball pay-for-play. Hadn't heard the thing about Murphy, but I'm not doubting.

Otherwise, I think Oats is happy in Tuscaloosa. Likes his money, likes Byrne, likes a lot of stuff. But not the pay-for-play distribution.

Now, put yourself in Byrne's shoes:
1. You have a football team that really needs some players and your whole Athletic Department depends on that. Trash football -- or even hobble it just a little bit -- and all umpteen sports crumble.

2. You have a basketball program that unquestionably deserves more money.

3. You have just gotten heat by announcing that even though the NCAA is essentially lifting caps on scholarships, you can afford only 40 new ones.

4. You've also just wiped the mud off your face for sending out a statement of reality that was widely construed as begging.

5. This last one overlaps Byrne and the new President. Athletic success has fueled a lot of out-of-state student enrollment. Which results in a lot more tuition. Which, given that higher education is a high fixed cost / low marginal cost proposition, is huge in offsetting the Alabama State Legislature's lack of support for higher education.

What do you do? Where do you get the money to keep football the unquestioned locomotive, make basketball happy, fund a bunch of other scholarships for non-revenue sports, do it without begging, and keep the rest of the University operation humming?

It's easy to trash. It's infinitely harder to build an effective response.

So you're Greg Byrne for a day. What's your move?

Since I'm notorious for asking for a better solution, I'll offer mine.

Taking money from football is a non-starter for a lot of reasons. Despite the 9-figure budget, they need more money too. So here's how I'd raise it for the Athletic Department as a whole:

1. Faculty and Staff pay face for football and basketball tickets. 100% of it goes to the pay-for-play collective. Late Add: Those folks can be a bit reactive and ornery, so maybe phase this on over a couple of years. Or offer payroll deduction 1/12 each month to ease the pain.

2. Reduce student football tickets to 10,000, awarded based on combination of GPA and credit hours earned. Empty seats indicate they either don't show up at all, or don't stay. So they'll yell, but their actions have been so loud I won't be able to hear what they'll say.

For basketball, keep student allocation as is. The student group (Crimson Chaos) makes a huge difference in close games. Thanks to Fluffapotamous for that, RIP. Plus, removing a couple thousand student basketball tickets wouldn't raise much money and would affect the atmosphere tremendously. Tradeoff just isn't worth the money.

3. Allocate the newfound football tickets to Tide Pride. Use the money for athletic scholarships, especially non-revenue sports.

4. For both football and basketball, impose a fee of 20% of the Tide Pride membership, including those in #3 above. 100% of the fee goes to the pay-for-play collective.

5. As a last ditch, cut some non-revenue men's sports. It would save some money, though not a ton, and wouldn't run us afoul of Title IX.

No, none of that is perfect. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. I'm open to other ideas that solve the five problems Greg Byrne and the new president, whoever he or she is, faces.

Disagree with the proposal all you want. Just come up with a better combination of options that raises the funds necessary to be athletically competitive in today's world.

I'm all ears.
 
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ga tide man #9

1st Team
Jan 16, 2003
404
243
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trion ga.
I understand CNO wanting more NIL money, but it’s hard to compare to football because of roster size. There’s a lot of difference in bringing in and retaining 85 players versus 13.
 

CB4

Hall of Fame
Aug 8, 2011
11,380
18,325
187
Birmingham, AL
On ESPN they were talking about Buzz going to Maryland and was it a better choice. Seth said that he heard from a very very reliable source at A&M that Buzz and AD Trev Albert’s had only spoken 1 time in the last year and that Trev only cared about the football program. If that is true that makes sense why he wanted out of there.
Bucky McMillan has his work cut out for him. He can have a team meeting “in a phone booth” as there is only one scholarship player remaining on the team at TAMU.
 

BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
Apr 1, 2004
22,891
20,943
282
Boone, NC
Good move not divulging good sources. Takes years or decades to build them. But the tap of an 'Enter' key can destroy them forever and trash your name amongst other good sources -- there aren't that many of them, and they tend to know each other.

Regarding Oats, I actually think you're both right. I've heard some rumblings about Oats' disappointment with basketball pay-for-play. Hadn't heard the thing about Murphy, but I'm not doubting.

Otherwise, I think Oats is happy in Tuscaloosa. Likes his money, likes Byrne, likes a lot of stuff. But not the pay-for-play distribution.

Now, put yourself in Byrne's shoes:
1. You have a football team that really needs some players and your whole Athletic Department depends on that. Trash football -- or even hobble it just a little bit -- and all umpteen sports crumble.

2. You have a basketball program that unquestionably deserves more money.

3. You have just gotten heat by announcing that even though the NCAA is essentially lifting caps on scholarships, you can afford only 40 new ones.

4. You've also just wiped the mud off your face for sending out a statement of reality that was widely construed as begging.

5. This last one overlaps Byrne and the new President. Athletic success has fueled a lot of out-of-state student enrollment. Which results in a lot more tuition. Which, given that higher education is a high fixed cost / low marginal cost proposition, is huge in offsetting the Alabama State Legislature's lack of support for higher education.

What do you do? Where do you get the money to keep football the unquestioned locomotive, make basketball happy, fund a bunch of other scholarships for non-revenue sports, do it without begging, and keep the rest of the University operation humming?

It's easy to trash. It's infinitely harder to build an effective response.

So you're Greg Byrne for a day. What's your move?

Since I'm notorious for asking for a better solution, I'll offer mine.

Taking money from football is a non-starter for a lot of reasons. Despite the 9-figure budget, they need more money too. So here's how I'd raise it for the Athletic Department as a whole:

1. Faculty and Staff pay face for football and basketball tickets. 100% of it goes to the pay-for-play collective. Late Add: Those folks can be a bit reactive and ornery, so maybe phase this on over a couple of years. Or offer payroll deduction 1/12 each month to ease the pain.

2. Reduce student football tickets to 10,000, awarded based on combination of GPA and credit hours earned. Empty seats indicate they either don't show up at all, or don't stay. So they'll yell, but their actions have been so loud I won't be able to hear what they'll say.

For basketball, keep student allocation as is. The student group (Crimson Chaos) makes a huge difference in close games. Thanks to Fluffapotamous for that, RIP. Plus, removing a couple thousand student basketball tickets wouldn't raise much money and would affect the atmosphere tremendously. Tradeoff just isn't worth the money.

3. Allocate the newfound football tickets to Tide Pride. Use the money for athletic scholarships, especially non-revenue sports.

4. For both football and basketball, impose a fee of 20% of the Tide Pride membership, including those in #3 above. 100% of the fee goes to the pay-for-play collective.

5. As a last ditch, cut some non-revenue men's sports. It would save some money, though not a ton, and wouldn't run us afoul of Title IX.

No, none of that is perfect. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. I'm open to other ideas that solve the five problems Greg Byrne and the new president, whoever he or she is, faces.

Disagree with the proposal all you want. Just come up with a better combination of options that raises the funds necessary to be athletically competitive in today's world.

I'm all ears.
Is the lottery a way to divert funs to NIL for state schools? Does Georgia, Florida or Tenn?

While I'm not "for" the lottery, if the state is losing that "business" to bordering states Alabama will inevitably pass it.
 

lowend

All-SEC
Feb 20, 2005
1,461
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2. Reduce student football tickets to 10,000, awarded based on combination of GPA and credit hours earned. Empty seats indicate they either don't show up at all, or don't stay. So they'll yell, but their actions have been so loud I won't be able to hear what they'll say.
2b. Unused tickets get released back for online sales at the end of the 1st quarter. There are lots of students and fans milling about that would pay face value to get in late.
 

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