JessN: Michigan wrap-up: Bama needs a clean break from this identity

[TideEngineer08]

It is not a decision though at this point. He was here 1 year with just a few players he brought over, who by the way were probably the best players on the team. Bernard was a #1 wide receiver and Parker one of the best lineman on the team. There was some chemistry issues even before he took over based on the reports last year after the Rose Bowl. That fact Saban decided last minute to leave tells me much more about the players in that locker room than a coach that has to inherit them. Either way they are not eating 60 million dollars after 1 year with a coach that has had success in the past and came in less then a year ago. They will let him bring in his guys at least a year or two before any decision is even thought about.

Oh I think they must let him turn this roster over - make it his entirely. Then see how the chips fall. I know its no use looking back... I was just saying. Perhaps it wasn't the best track to take, but we did so we have to see it through.

 

[JessN]

I think what has to be questioned, and some have no doubt even when the hire was made, is why the stark departure from the Nick Saban way? Not that it had to be a Nick Saban-tree hire, but someone of the same style. DeBoer is a departure from that in every way, from the offensive philosophy to the method of personnel management.

I don't know the answers. I'm glad I don't make the decisions.

I actually was glad they went as far away from Saban as they could. There's basically two times you do that: When you're at the top, or at the bottom. And we were in the final four last year so we were as close to the top as you can get.

The thinking there is unless there truly is a Nick Saban II out there -- and if there is, it's Kirby Smart, who we weren't going to be able to attract under any circumstance -- if you start going down the tree you end up getting a copy of a copy, so to speak.

The other thing Alabama fans need to reconcile is that Saban's system was starting to show cracks, too. Not just in schemes but in the way the program was run. On top of that, the one guy that had enough Saban in him, potentially, and who Alabama could get to was Cignetti, who absolutely no Alabama fan would have been happy with Byrne for hiring at the time. Zero. I'm just being realistic and honest.

Finally, fans seem to like coaches who treat the kids like it's a military exercise but that's not how college football is running right now. You have players making more than their position coaches, but without the maturity of age or the structure of the NFL there to enforce some standards of organization. I think Byrne looked at all of that and (correctly) decided to take the guy he thought was the best talent available and on his book, that was DeBoer.

 

[Bpilktree]

Maybe, but ultimately it rests on the head coach.

Milroe should have been benched against OU and today.

It may or may not have made a difference in the outcomes, but a change was warranted in both.

It tells you he didn’t have confidence in Simpson imo. Another issue is the offense was designed around Milroe to best fit his skill set which is different then Simpson’s. I won’t be surprised next season Simpson is still not the starter. He isn’t Deboer’s guy but was just inherited him like Milroe.

 

[JessN]

Just scanned the article, but the blame is on Byrne. He hired the wrong coach. On paper, DeBoer seemed to be a home run hire, but he isn’t. I’m not sure who the right coach is, but Deboer isn’t it. Better to rip the band aid off and try again than to continue with the wrong guy.

Couple of things are going to stop you there. I said some of it in the article but will shorten it up:

1) The buyout. We're not changing coaches for 2-3 years minimum. We can either spend $60M trying to attract talent or $60M chasing another coaching hire that hasn't even been 12 months ago.

2) If you do hit the reset button that fast and again don't get "the right guy," then you run the real risk of imploding the entire program for a decade or more. In order to get me to get on board for that, I would have to know EXACTLY who the "right guy" was before you did this. And of course there's no way to know that, so when you couple this with point No. 1, the best course of action is for everyone to get together over the next week or two, debrief the season and then try again with the same people involved, or you're probably going to get something you really don't want.

 

[Tide-one-on]

I think CKD is a very good coach. Let's let him get his players in and coaches he trusts and some portal guys for help. He has not missed a beat with HS recruitment so I feel good with him.

 

[Isaiah 63:1]

It tells you he didn’t have confidence in Simpson imo. Another issue is the offense was designed around Milroe to best fit his skill set which is different then Simpson’s. I won’t be surprised next season Simpson is still not the starter. He isn’t Deboer’s guy but was just inherited him like Milroe.

The overwhelming majority of trusted sources on this site (and I’m not one) have provided insight all season long that stands in opposition to your opinion …

 

[Bpilktree]

The overwhelming majority of trusted sources on this site (and I’m not one) have provided insight all season long that stands in opposition to your opinion …

Simpson threw 1 pass during SEC play this season even though there was calls to bring him in at least a few games. You would think they would want to get him some action in games if he was the guy you were confident he would be starting some.

 

[LeBron47]

Jess EXCELLENT article…. It clearly lays out the problems and even offers hope that the coaching staff will huddle together before Spring and get the talent on the field that best fit Coach Debeor’s scheme while adding solutions to our lack of running game. I left the stadium totally befuddled but see clearer now. Let’s see what the man can do with his players running his schemes. Totally thrilled with the defense today!

 

[Rocky Mtn Bob]

“…if he really believes he’s the long-term answer for this program, he’ll change his approach next year regarding accountability – not necessarily to any kind of behavioral standard, but simply the accountability to produce.”

@JessN, the above is the only thing you wrote with which I disagree. Behaviors are almost always precursors to results (credit: Patrick Lencioni). What I saw watching Alabama football this season was not a team, but a collection of individual talent that did not prioritize the kinds of behaviors that get the results Alabama expects on the field. From Germie Bernard’s mocking Jump Around after Wisky, to alleged trash talking before and Malachi’s behavior at the close of the first loss, through sulking Milroe, all the way to Jefferson’s unsportsmanlike penalty today in the last loss (all but the latter of which were devoid of evident consequences), it all reeked of an entitled team demanding unearned respect (an external factor) rather than holding itself and each other accountable for behaviors.

I’ve been part of and led enough teams to believe I can spot a dysfunctional one a mile away. This was one, and not because of the W-L record. Rather, I’d wager the record reflected the lack of accountability to a behavioral standard…

A thought-provoking post, Isaiah. I like the Lencioni reference, too.

 

[bvandegraff]

Couple of things are going to stop you there. I said some of it in the article but will shorten it up:

1) The buyout. We're not changing coaches for 2-3 years minimum. We can either spend $60M trying to attract talent or $60M chasing another coaching hire that hasn't even been 12 months ago.

2) If you do hit the reset button that fast and again don't get "the right guy," then you run the real risk of imploding the entire program for a decade or more. In order to get me to get on board for that, I would have to know EXACTLY who the "right guy" was before you did this. And of course there's no way to know that, so when you couple this with point No. 1, the best course of action is for everyone to get together over the next week or two, debrief the season and then try again with the same people involved, or you're probably going to get something you really don't want.

This type of rational, thoughtful analysis has no place on a Bama board following a bad loss. Everyone must be fired now now now now.

 

[NorCalTide]

Way too easy on Milroe, IMO.

My question is why was he so easy on him and why did he always look like he was thinking "there is nothing I can do about this". That's what leads me to believe that there were some serious backroom deals in January.

 

[bvandegraff]

“…if he really believes he’s the long-term answer for this program, he’ll change his approach next year regarding accountability – not necessarily to any kind of behavioral standard, but simply the accountability to produce.”

@JessN, the above is the only thing you wrote with which I disagree. Behaviors are almost always precursors to results (credit: Patrick Lencioni). What I saw watching Alabama football this season was not a team, but a collection of individual talent that did not prioritize the kinds of behaviors that get the results Alabama expects on the field. From Germie Bernard’s mocking Jump Around after Wisky, to alleged trash talking before and Malachi’s behavior at the close of the first loss, through sulking Milroe, all the way to Jefferson’s unsportsmanlike penalty today in the last loss (all but the latter of which were devoid of evident consequences), it all reeked of an entitled team demanding unearned respect (an external factor) rather than holding itself and each other accountable for behaviors.

I’ve been part of and led enough teams to believe I can spot a dysfunctional one a mile away. This was one, and not because of the W-L record. Rather, I’d wager the record reflected the lack of accountability to a behavioral standard…

The constant trash talking and celebrating plays when we weren't really dominating a game to say nothing of a lot of stupid, unsportsmanlike -type penalties were one of the most frustrating and embarrassing things about this team.

 

[Rocky Mtn Bob]

I don't know where to put this, so here goes....

We had some family urgencies which required me to record the 2nd half. I watched that half hours after the live game ended. Thanks, friends of mine who DID NOT call or text me about what was shappening....

(Everything worked-out for my family stuff.)

I was (initially) gratified to see Milroe attempt some touch passes -- by design, as outlets, etc. I noticed he has a tendency to miss high / float those touch passes. (IOW, he doesn't seem to have much in the way of "touch".)

How can anyone reach a premier team's QB position and not be able to ... make quicker reads ... go through multiple check downs ... spot the blitzing player(s) ... GET RID OF THE DING-DONG BALL?

If any Pro Scouts are reading this, j/k. Jalen's a super-talented Pro prospect.

 

[colbysullivan]

Any analysis that says anything other than “Milroe is 95% of Bama’s problems, and DeBoer is ultimately to blame for not benching him” is straight up wrong. You have your head in the sand if you see it any other way.

 

[JessN]

Simpson threw 1 pass during SEC play this season even though there was calls to bring him in at least a few games. You would think they would want to get him some action in games if he was the guy you were confident he would be starting some.

I guess I need to know where those "calls to bring him in" were coming from. If you mean fans calling for it, fans call for a lot of things. The best thing a coach can do is ignore fans altogether.

As to the substance of the discussion, I don't think the coaches' confidence in Simpson, or lack thereof, was ever the issue. I have heard several times, including today from someone I trust almost implicitly in matters like this, who say the staff believes Simpson can be the answer next year. Why not this year? Not my team, not my place to say. I can just speculate. Early in the year, it was very clear why: One, Milroe was playing well (remember he led the betting board for the Heisman after Georgia). Two, at the time the staff was placing high emphasis on getting the team to stabilize emotionally and buy into the new way of doing things.

You would think that later on in the year, the second item would have reached equilibrium. Maybe it didn't. If it didn't, then there's a lot more to the supposed "team factions" discussion than we've been led to believe. I think, at least today, that the issue was more one of working the gameplan they had for this game and probably not benching Milroe in his final start at UA.

The other explanation is that he simply was the best option, which scares people but it's not out of the realm of possibility, either. And that's not a question I think we can answer until the first game of 2025.

 

[B1GTide]

The other explanation is that he simply was the best option, which scares people but it's not out of the realm of possibility, either. And that's not a question I think we can answer until the first game of 2025.

He was the only option because DeBoer did not prepare anyone but Milroe for this game. That scares me, but for reasons which differ from yours. I knew what Milroe was.

 

[merino]

Simpson threw 1 pass during SEC play this season even though there was calls to bring him in at least a few games. You would think they would want to get him some action in games if he was the guy you were confident he would be starting some.

Perhaps DeBoer felt the team would mutiny if he benched JM? For the past 2 years, Ty never had the opportunity to play with the first string, only mop-up duty

 

[B1GTide]

Perhaps DeBoer felt the team would mutiny if he benched JM? For the past 2 years, Ty never had the opportunity to play with the first string, only mop-up duty

Let them mutiny. Shrug. You lost with them. Lose without them.

 

[92tide]

it was nice to read this part

It’s a painful sentence to write, because Milroe has been one of the best representatives of the school that Alabama could have ever asked for. Wild rumors aside about players or groups of players intervening on his behalf during the times he struggled on the field, Milroe never gave Alabama any heartburn off of it. For two years, he was the public face of the program and handled it as well as anyone else who could have been put in that position, or has been put in that position.

 

[OBMS]

Watch me smile at this quote----- "The other thing Alabama fans need to reconcile is that Saban's system was starting to show cracks, too. Not just in schemes but in the way the program was run."

It is almost as though no one recognized Saban giving us a clear look at the future in Tampa in 2023. This "team" has been controlled by the big dogs in the locker room for that long. When they decided they were only going to play for #4 in the spring of 2023, the matter of a starting quarterback was settled. The limitations that created were too much for even Saban to overcome and were certainly too much for CKB to overcome. Now, the only possibility is to make the change that has been inevitable for almost two years, even if it destroys the locker room. Thankfully, enough has been revealed to make that less of a likely outcome but the possibility still exists.