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Robert Nkimdeche vs. Jadeveon Clowney

T

tungi01

1st Team
Apr 17, 2010
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Dallas, TX
If this question has been posted before then MODS please delete. With that said, who do you guys feel is the better prospect? I realize that Robert still has to play his senior season, however, I'm hearing a lot of the same accolades, that Clowney received, being given to Nkimdeche. Thanks and RTR!!!
 
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I think that they are different type of players. Both are freak athletes but Clowney is probably faster and needs to add weight and RN is more college ready with his size. RN could play DT DE or LB. Clowney couldnt play inside. That being said for us I would say RN for a team that runs 4-3 Clowney
 
Nkimdeche is probably a more ideal fit for a down linemen in our defense. Clowney wants to be a pure 4-3 WDE and not a 3-4 OLB. So we weren't the ideal fit but he could have been an exceptional pass rushing Jack LB. Nkimdeche is the exact kind of SDE you look for in a 3-4 defense. He's capable of holding up when needed to playing gaps in the run games, he can bull rush, but also take a quick first move to the edge.

Using current pro players, Clowney is more like Dwight Freeney while Nkimdeche is more like Justin Smith.
 
brutetough said:
need a cage fight to settle it...
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I'd never wanna get in a fight with either of these guys! And yes, I can certainly see where the comparison comes from but I'm hearing that Robert is even more impressive than Clowney was.

Speaking of Robert, I head from a buddy at work that he's a Bama lean, has anything come out regarding his favorite schools? He would be an amazing pick up to an already stellar looking class.
 
His high school coach played on the 1992 Alabama squad. That certainly will help our staff get a foot in the door but it will ultimately come down to the staff selling all the things we can do to enhance his pro prospects. No doubt they mention how they developed Dareus and how he moved all across the DL to exploit the matchup issues he creates. I think that is ultimately why we sign him. Saban will let him know that even with DL depth, there are so many speciality packages and rotations that he could contribute early. As he grows with the program, they'll put more on his plate and allow him to reach his potential as a pro prospect.
 
rgw said:
Nkimdeche is probably a more ideal fit for a down linemen in our defense. Clowney wants to be a pure 4-3 WDE and not a 3-4 OLB. So we weren't the ideal fit but he could have been an exceptional pass rushing Jack LB. Nkimdeche is the exact kind of SDE you look for in a 3-4 defense. He's capable of holding up when needed to playing gaps in the run games, he can bull rush, but also take a quick first move to the edge.

Using current pro players, Clowney is more like Dwight Freeney while Nkimdeche is more like Justin Smith.
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ND will be a Jack from day one. Watch
 
TideorDie87 said:
I think that they are different type of players. Both are freak athletes but Clowney is probably faster and needs to add weight and RN is more college ready with his size. RN could play DT DE or LB. Clowney couldnt play inside. That being said for us I would say RN for a team that runs 4-3 Clowney
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This^
 
ND is already bigger than Upshaw as a high school junior. He's probably going to grow into the 280-285 range with his frame. He's a SDE through and through. Will he move around and play something like a WDE/JLB? Probably, heck I see him as the type of player who will eventually play every down lineman position here. Jack won't be his home though in my opinion. He's really best used with his hands down and not being used as a coverage guy as JLB sometimes dictates.
 
Being that size doesnt mean he will play DE from the jump just look at Mario Williams. The thing you have to understand that this kid wants to rush the QB not just plug the line and the Jack position is for rushing the QB.
 
If he doesn't grow to much , he will be ultimate jack LB. He will make upshaw look like a schoolboy, and that's saying something.
 
He's not a prototypical Jack LB though but that doesn't mean he can't be a pass rusher.

Justin Smith is a 3-4 DE on the 49ers and he's a huge component in their pass rush. Just because JLB is the designated rusher in a 3-4 doesn't mean 3-4 pressure only comes from the LBs. In fact, the 3-4 is especially deadly when the SDE can affect the passer instead of just being a hearty run stopper. I'm sure he'd play on the weak side a good bit in known passing situations but is starting position will be on the strong side. He also has the potential to be that gap-shooting NG like Gentry this past season too.

He's just going to be too big to be the every down JLB at Alabama. He's too good of a pass rusher not to be moved around but his size gives him the versatility of attacking whatever weakness we discover on an opponent's OL. There may be times when we know he can beat the interior linemen, other times when we feel the tackles can't handle his bull rush, and some times when we feel he can simply beat a tackle around the corner. He's not a JLB but that doesn't mean he can't be schemed into rush opportunities from any down linemen position. With his likely growth over the next few years - especially when he gets to college - he's going to be a DC's matchup dream.
 
In the 3-4 system we run, it would be in our best interest to use him as a Jack linebacker. He is incredibly gifted in terms of size and speed, with a very long reach and great mobility. To use him as a SDE would be really a waste of his talent. The SDE on our D has the 5 hole gap responsibility and is generally limited in pass rushing because of this. You want a Marcel/Jesse Williams sized guy to play that spot that can hold down the fort so to speak; not a long lean pass rusher.

The way you get pressure from that 5 technique DE is for them to just blow up their guy, maintain the gap and push the OT back into the QB's lap. Someone mentioned Justin Smith, well watch how he and Haloti Ngata do it, they just destroy people with the bullrush and maintain their responsibilty. Whereas the Jack LB is more of your Demarcus Ware/Terrell Suggs who are going to just do anything and everything with less regard to the gap to get to the QB. JLB is more of a freelance position.

Marcel was able to get after the QB because he's incredibly gifted, and I'm sure Robert could too, but the fact of the matter is that you're really better off having him move around the way the Jack LB does to give him the best opportunity to get after the QB and stop the run. Then on passing downs when we go to the nickel he can put his hand on the ground and rush as a traditional edge rusher.

It's a pretty easy answer to me, he'd play Jack LB in a 3-4 and in a 4-3 he'd be a dominant DE. He'll be great at whatever he does though.
 
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He's supposedly already 270lbs though. He's going to be a huge player once he gets into S&C at college. I think people are misguided in saying SDE can't be a rush position. Alabama is very multiple in what gaps the linemen play. Our NGs don't always play 0-tech, the SDEs don't always play 5-tech, etc. Alabama has shown that they can change responsibilities to highlight their best rushers depending on the roster. Dareus was our best rusher in 2009 and he played mostly SDE but he played a lot on third down when the responsibilities changed typically for that position.

I think ND would play as weak side edge rusher on 3rd down, they'll also move him around because he's going to be a huge Reggie White-like pass rusher. BUT if I had to figure his likely home, he'll end up being an SDE.
 
rgw said:
He's not a prototypical Jack LB though but that doesn't mean he can't be a pass rusher.

Justin Smith is a 3-4 DE on the 49ers and he's a huge component in their pass rush. Just because JLB is the designated rusher in a 3-4 doesn't mean 3-4 pressure only comes from the LBs. In fact, the 3-4 is especially deadly when the SDE can affect the passer instead of just being a hearty run stopper. I'm sure he'd play on the weak side a good bit in known passing situations but is starting position will be on the strong side. He also has the potential to be that gap-shooting NG like Gentry this past season too.

He's just going to be too big to be the every down JLB at Alabama. He's too good of a pass rusher not to be moved around but his size gives him the versatility of attacking whatever weakness we discover on an opponent's OL. There may be times when we know he can beat the interior linemen, other times when we feel the tackles can't handle his bull rush, and some times when we feel he can simply beat a tackle around the corner. He's not a JLB but that doesn't mean he can't be schemed into rush opportunities from any down linemen position. With his likely growth over the next few years - especially when he gets to college - he's going to be a DC's matchup dream.
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Totally disagree with you. You cant say who is the prototypical type of player for a certain type of position. You compare him to Upshaw but he is probably faster than Upshaw. This kid is a freak. He can get stronger without adding a lot of weight. Even if he does gain 10-15 pounds he still wont look big at all. He looks like a LB now.
 
rgw said:
He's supposedly already 270lbs though. He's going to be a huge player once he gets into S&C at college. I think people are misguided in saying SDE can't be a rush position. Alabama is very multiple in what gaps the linemen play. Our NGs don't always play 0-tech, the SDEs don't always play 5-tech, etc. Alabama has shown that they can change responsibilities to highlight their best rushers depending on the roster. Dareus was our best rusher in 2009 and he played mostly SDE but he played a lot on third down when the responsibilities changed typically for that position.

I think ND would play as weak side edge rusher on 3rd down, they'll also move him around because he's going to be a huge Reggie White-like pass rusher. BUT if I had to figure his likely home, he'll end up being an SDE.
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Listen our 3 down lineman are there to open up gaps for our linebackers or to single up the jack to go 1 on 1. That all. We play 3 DTs as our front 3 really besides Square.
 
That is simply a gross simplification of the 3-4 defense. Bum Phillips created the 1-gap 3-4 defense and many "3-4 defenses" in the NFL use this in favor of the traditional 2-gap 3-4. I've seen Alabama use both schemes under Saban. Typically when Gentry was in at NG, we were playing some derivation of a 1-gap responsibility. Our base is definitely a 2-gap double bubble 3-4 but we are capable of adjusting so to give the offense different looks. We're a really a multiple defense not just a 3-4 defense.
 
to answer the question i feel as though Clowney is the better prospect. the guy has a rare combination of good size, power, and speed. he is outstanding using his hands as well when rushing the QB. he plays with the aggression of Lawrence Taylor
 
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