News Article: So ISIS Wants to Find out how we Roll...Attacks Anti-Islam Event in Texas

Tide1986

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Nov 22, 2008
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That's the distinction people are missing.

If I want to walk into a Black Panther meeting loudly proclaiming that James Earl Ray did this nation a favor, I absolutely have the right to do so. And after emergency services scrapes up whatever is left of me from the pavement, someone just might get charged in my death, because they did not have the right to kill me just because I ....ed them off. But how many people, white and black alike, would say "Serves you right, dumbazz"?
I would, and I'd set a Darwin Award on your tombstone as well.
 

Bama Reb

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Utter awesomeness!!!


I recall a conversation I had with a guy in medical school (he was Army, I was **) who was an atheist. He told me I was the only Bible thumper he'd ever met that he actually liked (quite the exaggeration since I'm not but I guess there are degrees of everything). I looked back at him and said, "I hate your atheism and we obviously disagree, but I'd stand back to back with you and defend your right not only to not believe in my God but to make fun of Him if you so desired." He sorta smiled and said, "And I feel the same way about you." We fist bumped and that was that. And he was quite the ultraconservative/libertarian. Heck, we agreed about most things except religion. Granted, the military instills that value into folks but it's still important to live it.

I hated the cross in the urine but you know what? I don't want it banned (although whether this is deserving of federal funding is another issue altogether). Better a few things that should be left unsaid than censorship and calling it freedom.
I don't want it banned either, mainly because it's not our place to take whatever corrective or retaliatory measures to which we might be tempted. The thing is, God will have the last laugh and will take care of that all on His own. :biggrin:
 

BamaPokerplayer

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there is a pretty big difference in saying "it may not be the best idea to do that" and "don't do that"

"the muslim folk" didn't cause the trouble. two d-bags who are muslim did. again, a pretty big difference.
You right, I would like to apologize to all 17 of the peaceful Muslims in the world.
 

cuda.1973

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Well, I think I am done answering phone calls and e-mails. I'll try not to repeat what I posted earlier, but since I have recounted this more times than I can remember, well, it might happen.

OK, prelude:

A few moths back, a buddy e-mailed me, and asked if I was going to this event. Never heard of it. But, as it was around the corner from my house, and I have a tendency to take pot shots at sacred cows, why not!

My buddy is a lefty atheist. I bet if you asked him that he will say all religions are responsible for much of the violence that has occurred, through the ages. Which means all are just as bad as the next.

OK, maybe. Not important to me. My buddy is an ok guy, who is frustrated at the lack of civil discourse, in America. (Irony alert: Muslims and civil discourse!) He feels each side is too deeply entrenched, and won't listen to reason.

Ok, maybe. Not important to me. But, the two of us can get along, so I am fine with going with him.

I had no prior knowledge who Pam Geller is. Had to research who she is, as it played no part in my attendance. I have a lot of Muslim buddies, but their families have been here since the 60s and 70s, so they are very much assimilated into our culture. Plus, they are all professionals, of one sort or another. Not peasants, like my ancestors were, when they came to America. So, I harbor no "Islamophobic" feelings. Whatever that manufactured word means. But I do have it in for fascists, of an kind.

Whatever.

My atheist buddy reads a broad spectrum of articles, as he is interested in what both sides have to say. And he has warmed up to the idea of all this surveillance, that a lot of us are really wary of, that is taking place. And he has realized, unlike a lot of his lefty buddies, that radical Islam is an extreme threat to our way of life.

So, he wants to attend this event, hear the speakers and show his support for freedom of speech. If it offends some radical nut jobs, so be it. Our daily existence offends the more extreme ones, so how much worse can this make it? He does not want to drive for several hours, and go by himself. Gee, he is lucky he knows a local troublemaker, who is more that up for going.

OK, I am in, so to speak.

Not knowing anything about this event, who or what Pam Geller is, I do some digging, as my buddy has pointed out this may be a counter to a previous event, held back in Jan. or Feb. (You can dig up the details, if you need to know that badly, ok?)

This event center, owned by the school district, was used for some "anti-Islamapbobia" (or whatever) conference a few moths back. Seems it attracted some attention, and the subsequent backlash. There were some protestors, and Geller may have been involved in that. (Not important to me.)

What I did find interesting was the group who ran this event was out of Chicago.

HUH?

They couldn't find a local venue for this stuff? They had to come all the way to Texas. Why? To see if they can whip up the local Muslim community? (There are parts of town that you can not park in, on Friday afternoon, as the locals park anywhere and everywhere. Despite numerous "NO PARKING AT ANY TIME" signs.) (I suppose we have to be tolerant of their inability to observe our most basic and civil laws. I guess they really believe their laws are of a higher order than any of our man-made ones, so we have do deal with the mess they create every Friday afternoon.) (Need I point out that none of their cars ever get ticketed or towed? Maybe we should try the same thing. No, on second thought.................)

Pam Geller gets upset, and wants to know the school district allowed this conference to take place. Seems they allow anyone to use it, as it is in theory a public venue.

Geller says they have to allow her to use it, if that truly is their policy. Fine, but they insist she puts up $10k, for security, before they will allow her to book an event.

She does. They set things up, and we are off and running.

As long as you can pony up $50 to get in. Someone was very kind and purchased my ticket. I had to supply some personal info, as photo ID and a ticker would be required to get in.

Next: getting in the event, and waiting around for it to start.
 

NationalTitles18

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May 25, 2003
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Cuda, I appreciate your account of events and look forward to the rest ......of the story.


I'm basically hearing folks say more or less the same things, but in different order and with different emphasis. We all seem to think Gellar likes to stir the pot. She is being deliberately offensive. She has the right to say whatever she wants. Drawing cartoons of a certain historical figure makes some crazy people want to shoot and kill people.

Frankly, to me all the talk about Gellar hating Muslims is just a distraction from the core issue. It is a diversion. It just doesn't matter.

Stirring the pot doesn't matter either. In fact, the more the pot is stirred the better. We need pot stirrers. Pot stirrers cause society to move and change often enough that putting up with a few obnoxious folks is worth it.

Where I have a problem with some folks is when they say, "Of course she has freedom of speech, but...."

But nothing. The reason this has become a free speech issue is that not only do far too many Muslims want to kill those who offend their prophet, but far too many more want to actually use government to censor such speech. And others seem to want to see that happen. Many are calling this hate speech and seriously asking if it crosses the line from protected speech into inciting violence or some other convoluted something or another. These are prominent people who are very serious in proposing restrictions to this kind of speech.

And that is worrisome. Because too many people already feel that if you don't hold the correct opinion or if you express it or if you work or contribute money politically to an effort that isn't correct then you shouldn't have a job, should be fined, and so forth.

And in Europe there ARE restrictions on "hate speech" as defined by the powers that be. And some want to bring that system here.

Freedom loving people can plainly see an erosion and/or attempt to erode the rights related to freedom of conscience - religion, speech, association, etc;... We get concerned when people want to curb those rights for whatever reason - even those with good intentions. Even when we disagree with what is being said or done to cause them to feel that way. Even when our sensibilities are offended.

We are at one of those critical points in history, IMHO. This is true not just on this issue, but others as well. We either give up rights to appease those who are offended or have been done wrong in the past and let them take revenge or satisfaction in our situation or we all agree that freedom and equality under the law arer more important. (Didn't want to distract with a list of other issues, so I hope that made some sense)
 

TIDE-HSV

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I think that part of what makes them and their motives so opaque to us is that, in the West, we have managed, to a surprising degree, to peel religion off from politics. This is not so in a very large slice of the Muslim world. Politics and religion are all tied up together in their minds...
 

seebell

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Interesting article from the Daily Beast. Good links. I will shortly become a Muslim bashing TV evangelist. The money will roll in.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...lucrative.html?via=newsletter&source=politics

In Geller’s case, her salary is paid from her organization the American Freedom Defense Initiative (AFDI), a group listed by the SPLC as an active “anti-Muslim organization.” In 2013, the AFDI reported $958,800 in gross receipts and paid Geller a base salary of $192,500, plus $18,750 in other income (PDF).

Not bad for a group created, per AFDI’s tax returns, to act “against the treason being committed by the national, state and local government officials, the mainstream media and others in their capitulation to the global jihad and Islamic Supremacism.” This is truly one step removed from tin foil hats and claims that the government has bugged your cheese.
 

cuda.1973

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OK, managed to get caught up my "work", so to Chapter 2.

A few weeks before the event, my buddy sends me an e-mail, informing me they need some personal info, so I can be admitted to the event. It was from some guy named Robert Spencer, but I paid no attention who it was from. (Did it really matter? One of the organizers is good enough.)

My buddy also sends me a link to where I can see most (if not all) of the entries on-line. Having a warped sense of humor, I had my ideas on what "draw Muhammad" means.

Now, I am not naive, but I am a weisenheimer. Since it did not specifically say that the entries had to be strictly about the so-called Great Prophet, that left the door wide open for any number of other snide entries.

To be more specific, one could easily use the colloquial version, iow "Moe", as the theme of the artwork. But, alas, my artistic abilities are on par with a second-grader, drawing stick men with ray guns. So, I did not submit anything.

Some folks did have a similar idea, and "Moe" was repersented, as in Moe Howard, of the Three Stooges. (Somehow, I have a feeling that quirk would escape the acumen of 99.9999% of the offended parties.) Another did use an idea similar to mine, where it showed someone pointing at a gather of stereotypical men, in Arabic garb, being informed that someone made a drawing of them, and entered it in a "draw Muhammad" contest. Recoiling in horror and aversion, of course!

Which does get to part of the absurdity of the whole "You can't draw Muhammad" nonsense.

Which one? The Great Prophet one, or the dozen or so guys I know, who really are named Muhammad? I can make a drawing of anyone, and say it is Muhammad. Unless I specifically say, in big bold letters, it is their so-called prophet, how can anyone say "Hey, you can't draw that!"

If we can't draw Muhammad, then why do so many of them name their sons that?

And if we can't draw him, who is to say that a drawing that states it is Muhammad really is "that" Muhammad?

In theory, no one has ever drawn him, and therefore, we can not know what he looks like.

(Actually, the last part is not true, but that is for Part 4.)

Compare this to Christianity, where one flavor (the Catholics) love their depictions of Jesus, even though probably not a single one remotely looks like Jesus did.

You can even take an image of him, and put it in a jar of you-know, and no one has their head hacked off. But, somehow, the religion of peace seems to be of a different school of thought.

Well, tough. They may think their divine laws, that supposedly come from on high, trump all man-made laws, but that is not how it works in non-Muslim countries. Yet, the "radical" elements think otherwise.

Some folks take offense to all these stealthy measures to place the free world under sharia, and they take steps to combat it.

But, back to the cartoons...............

Frankly, very few of them were funny. (Yes, I was disappointed.) Not many were clever. A lot were nothing more than poking a stick in their eye, but so be it. Some were in what I would call bad taste, and that is a low bar to clear. Tongue-in-check was not the main motif. Whether the right tactic to fight absurdity is being offensive is not how I would do it. I prefer to fight absurdity with something even more absurd. If it escalates, well, who is going to get hurt by being more absurd than the next guy?

But, they started the fight, and folks are well within their prerogative to fight back, in any way they see fit. Could this lead to violence? Well, in a sane world, the worst that would happen is a few bloody noses.

We obviously do not live in a sane world. We are not the ones who made that choice. We can back down, and cower in fear. Which will only mean the threshold for being offended is lowered even more.

Some of us offended these kooks just by being Jews. Then, the Christians. And probably next will be the atheists.

My buddy figured that out long ago. Going to an event like this, and standing up for freedom, is how he chooses to fight back.

On to the big day........
 

cuda.1973

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Part 3...........getting into the event, and the build up.

My buddy drives up from wherever, and we meet at the Walmart, practically next door. He suggests we park there, and walk, since we both need the exercise. Normally, I would do that. For some reason, I say I think it would be better if we park at the actual event.

"Why? Isn't is safe around here?"

"No, it is safe. I just think we will be better off if we park there."

(This decision could have been brilliant, and saved us a ton of grief, later. Or, it may have doomed us to having to stay in a hotel overnight.)

As soon as we exit the Walmart parking lot, I am struck by how much security there is. All entrances, except one, are roped off, and blocked by police cars.

Guess they were giving the organizers their $10k worth.

We have to show photo ID, and a ticket, at 2 checkpoints, to get in the parking lot. Each one had several Garland officers. They direct us to where they want us to park, and there is yet one more police car. Passed a few more, on the way.

We enter the center at the entrance furthest from the road. I thought that was a bit odd, but that was probably two-fold.

One was the main auditorium was going to be used for SAT testing, the next morning. So, can't use that part. Plus, moving us to the far entrance got us further away from any protestors that might show up.

One more checkpoint, to go through, complete with metal detector. Now we are in.

We are all aware that the event could face protestors, but that is all any of us expected would happen. I figured even that was remote, as any local group would have realized that with all the security present, that no protest was going to be effective. Plus, the word was the local Muslim "activists" were going to ignore the event, as they felt that would be more insulting than showing up and screaming at us. (Which did happen, when the initial event took place, earlier in the year.)

Not only was most every off-duty Garland officer working this, the SWAT guys were there. They looked serious. Assault rifles, with flash suppressors, and full body armor. And there were enough highly visible to deter anyone but the most kooky protestor. If we only knew...............

We mingle. I can hear some folks saying they are media. One woman approaches me, and attempts to interview me. I am unusually evasive. She asked if I support this. Too open-ended to merit a straight answer. I try to get clarification, which I never get. She continues to prod, probably hoping I will blurt out "I hate these goldurn camel jockeys" or something equally dumb. I calmly explain that since I am here, and it is just around the corner from my house, I can tell all my Muslim buddies just what did happen, on Monday morning. (Actually, come to think about it..............I haven't done that yet! Oh, well. Maybe later.) She leaves, in frustration.

I get the distinct impression that a great deal of the attendees are media, of one sort or another. Someone makes an announcement that we will not be allowed into the part where the actual exhibit is until the designated time. Doesn't seem to be a large turn-out, yet. Once inside, someone mentions there are roughly 300 people in attendance.

They start to let folks in. Some folks get extra special treatment, and they are seated in the first row of tables. Their tables have a goodie bag, of some sort.

Next, the "preferred" attendees are let in. No idea why I was in that group, but I had a name tag that stated as much. We are in the second row of tables. In the rear, there are tables set up, with pastries and refreshments. None of which I can eat. Well, at least it isn't freezing cold inside.

What appears to be the winning entry is at the front of the room. A small number of entries are exhibited. There is one exhibit, that seems to have a very small thumbnail version, of every cartoon entered, on it. Too small to read, so my buddy and I sit down.

I get into a discussion with a rather annoying lady, that lives in Allen, about what is going on in our schools. Seems she was a substitute teacher, in some other state. That, and apparently she managed to wander around our Freshman Center, leads her to believe she knows everything about what is going on. I know for a fact she is full of it, and I try to educate her. Imagine that: and "educator" that can not be educated. She already knows all of the facts, at least as she has determined them, and isn't interested in hearing anything else.

I quietly remark to my buddy this is why nothing can get done. Too many folks who think they are right, even when they are clueless. She is supposed to be on my side, and I can't stand her!

(Reminds me of my highly prejudiced and bigoted, not to mention extremely anti-Semitic, aunt. A good Christian! Probably just the sort of person the critics of Geller assumed would be in attendance. Little did they know an atheist was between us, and a much more pleasant individual.)

Time for the show.............
 

cuda.1973

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"On with the show, this is it!"

Pam Geller welcomes us. I still have little idea who she is, other than she had the fortitude to read Ayn Rand. OK, she is made of sterner stuff than I am. (Kinda like trying to read the libertarian version of Marcel Proust. Except Proust has nothing useful to say. He just said a lot. Lot of nothing. Over and over.) She is obviously from NYC.

She informs us she has been fighting anti-Semitic ads, placed on subway trains, in NYC. When her counter ads are placed, they are ripped down. Sounds like she is a lightning rod, not just for her opposition to the Islamization of the free world, but also the obvious hatred of my ancient people. (My Jewish buddies claim my mom brought the wrong baby home from the hospital. Except I look like her. I tell them it was her parents, the poor Italian immigrants, that brought the wrong baby home. Explains why Mom can not cook like her mom. Not even in the same ballpark.)

Geller explains she has been successful in suing the NYC transit authority. (Or, author-itah, for those of you in Miss-ourah.) As a result, they will no longer allow any political ads.


Cheers in the room.

She explains the winner of the contest has also won the People's Choice Award, as well as the official one, so that person gets the $10k and $2500 prizes. The guy is clearly an artist, which is evident from his entry. He catches the "You can't draw me." "Which is why I do." spirit of the event.

Geert Wilders is introduced.

This gentleman is a polished and articulate public speaker. Contrary to any impression the media may have portrayed him as, he is clearly not some nut, shouting on a street corner, to rabble, with too much time on their collective hands. He could just as well be a CEO or college professor. Especially discounting his native tongue is not English, he is a respectable person, who merits listening to.

Compare that to the idiots in our country..............like...................

Al NotSoSharpton, O'Dumbo, Notzy Pelosi, Prince Harry Greed, Johnny BoneHead, or Dudley DooNothing (the putz who runs our House of Lords). They could all take lessons from him.

No...........check that.............all are beyond hope. And useless.

Back to the subject at hand.

The key point of his address is that Islam and sharia are incompatible with democracy and liberty. His remarks are received enthusiastically.

To be honest, I did not memorize his speech, as we had no idea this would soon be at the heart of the war against Islamofascism. Other than to note he is a sharp guy.

He leaves as soon as he appeared. I am sure he was ushered out, under tight security, just as he had to be upon entry, as no one saw him arrive. He just appeared on the stage, and began his speech.

The winner is introduced, and we are told he is a former Muslim, of Albanian descent. After 9-11, he had to rethink his faith. We all could figure out how that turned out.

He begins his speech, and gives some background on himself. He said after 9-11, he had a lot of soul searching to do, and made a choice. One way that he dealt with his dilemma was to write about 2 brothers, who went through a similar process, after 9-11. One went full jihad, and the other went in the opposite direction. From this, he went on to write a comic book, of an anti-Muslim super hero. He thought hard what this character would be, when the obvious answer hit him.

Muslims regard the pig as the lowest life form around. So, he clothed his super hero in a leather outfit.

And called him Pig Man.

The comic became The Adventures of Pig Man.

Finally! Someone with a sense of humor! I like this guy. Smart and sarcastic.

After he is done speaking, Robert Spencer speaks. I still have no idea who he is, and it didn't really matter. (My buddy was annoyed, that I did not know who he was. "He is the guy who sent that e-mail needing your contact info." "Still doesn't tell me who he is.") The crux of his speech is that this whole "You can't draw you-know-who" is a lot of crap. He points out there are several depictions, of you-know-who, from ancient Persian texts, showing the man of mystery doing all sorts of mysterious things. We attempted to look at them, on our way out, but the lettering was very small and hard to read. (Plus, my buddy was in a hurry to get in his car and head back to his secret underground bunker.)

Don't remember much more of what he said, other than his heritage is Greek Orthodox.

I think. Honestly, did not pay much attention. The boss lady spoke, the guest of honor spoke, the winner spoke, and my buddy was anxious to leave. Maybe if I knew what would happen a few minutes later, I might have paid closer attention.

Or, I could have suffered another senior citizen moment, and still forgot. My apologies to Mr. Spencer...............it wasn't personal! It just happens.

OK, now it is over. We look at the Persian texts real quick, and bolt for the exit.

Next...............it hits the fan.................
 

GrayTide

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I think that part of what makes them and their motives so opaque to us is that, in the West, we have managed, to a surprising degree, to peel religion off from politics. This is not so in a very large slice of the Muslim world. Politics and religion are all tied up together in their minds...
I think this pretty much sums up all the current problems the non Muslim world is having with Muslims and affiliated terrorists groups. Where the hell is the LIKE button?
 

seebell

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Slight change of subject. Workers trying to get to Redstone Arsenal/NASA this morning were backed up for at least a mile at gate 10. Other gates were probably worse. Heard something about increased threat levels.

Yemeni Zack from the Maysville 4 Way has returned from his trip to the Middle east, He never made it to his family in Yemen, He made it to Saudi Arabia but the Saudis were not issuing visa or allowing travel to Yemen. 10,000 people trying to get into Yemen. He said trying to sneak across the border could be fatal. He said safety and food for the general population is becoming increasingly dire. sad.