The policy and politics of Trumpism

[GrayTide]

Wasn't Festivus Matt Dillon's deputy?

 

[rgw]

Simma down now. You know you can't change the liberal mindset until something catastrophic happens to them.

I mean, it is a fair question when it is very clear that the upper crust is trying to remove themselves from the tax burden. It begs the question since it seems like half or more of the tax burden of this country will be put upon the middle class in the next half century: just what is the average American getting out of this debt? If it isn't a country that creates opportunity for advancement and sustainment then we need to rise up now and make the billionaires accountable to their deeds because most of this wild spending was for their benefit if we're being frank. Even our social health and welfare programs are rife with handouts that made private entities billions instead of prioritizing the public good (in frugality/bang for your buck and public health).

 

[GrayTide]

When I think of oligarchs it reminds me of very rich Russian businessmen who wield a great deal of political influence. I guess this is a new term Americans will have to learn about the many American billionaires who control Trump and the GOP. Did we learn this from Russia or did they learn this from the U.S.?

 

[rgw]

I feel like it has always been like this here. Who'd ya think wanted to declare independence? Many of the people with significant holdings in this country.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

I mean, it is a fair question when it is very clear that the upper crust is trying to remove themselves from the tax burden. It begs the question since it seems like half or more of the tax burden of this country will be put upon the middle class in the next half century: just what is the average American getting out of this debt? If it isn't a country that creates opportunity for advancement and sustainment then we need to rise up now and make the billionaires accountable to their deeds because most of this wild spending was for their benefit if we're being frank. Even our social health and welfare programs are rife with handouts that made private entities billions instead of prioritizing the public good (in frugality/bang for your buck and public health).

Hey, no argument from me on this. I think I've made my position fairly clear on most of the spending issues. We don't have a tax issue per se, we have a spending issue. But, as long as the sheep stay sheep, the elite will continue to sheer them. Someone with money is making more money on the deal. It's just not us.

 

[Bamaro]

Just know that those of you who suddenly discovered the national debt now that Trump is President - but you supported both Obama AND the health car law - your posts are good for an amusing lesson in how to do an online about face but not to be taken seriously.

You don’t suddenly get to pretend you gare be a damn now. You don’t, you just don’t like Trump.


Now Earle’s comment about the default is truly funny, has me laughing. But sorry, you don’t get to undergo a conversion now like a death row inmate finding Jesus in the hope of getting a reprieve.


Besides, I’ve watched liberals like Paul Krugman spend years explaining why the debt is no big deal. Now, of course, we get all the boo hoo stories.

To my knowledge, we’ve had maybe four years in my lifetime where we ran a surplus. Even then the overall debt increased.

But those of you who actually believe that our children are going to pay back this debt, well, that’s as likely to actually happen as that wall Trump will never build.

The debt issue is a bipartisan problem as it effects all of us, especially the younger ones. When I was younger it seemed that the republicans were the fiscally responsible party. Then in the 80s they learned the political power of spending, borrowing and lying about it. We had a brief return to fiscal sanity in the late 90s but that quickly evaporated. Now neither party can be trusted to do anything meaningful about it other than giving it lip service when they are not the ones in power. As long as Washington can continue to buy votes with increased spending AND decreased taxes I foresee an impending collapse.
Anybody that thinks this latest tax cut will be good for the country on a macro level is delusional.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

The debt issue is a bipartisan problem as it effects all of us, especially the younger ones. When I was younger it seemed that the republicans were the fiscally responsible party. Then in the 80s they learned the political power of spending, borrowing and lying about it. We had a brief return to fiscal sanity in the late 90s but that quickly evaporated. Now neither party can be trusted to do anything meaningful about it other than giving it lip service when they are not the ones in power. As long as Washington can continue to buy votes with increased spending AND decreased taxes I foresee an impending collapse.
Anybody that thinks this latest tax cut will be good for the country on a macro level is delusional.

The problem is that neither party wants to address it. It's easier to bring home the bacon to each rep's district and keep the masses deaf, dumb and blind.

 

[2003TIDE]

The problem is that neither party wants to address it.

America has such a "I've got mine and thats all that matters mentality". I think they know the solution that addresses it is so ugly, they'd all get voted out for fixing it.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

America has such a "I've got mine and thats all that matters mentality". I think they know the solution that addresses it is so ugly, they'd all get voted out for fixing it.

Yep. I know. I shared a story about my in-laws getting a FEMA issued generator after a hurricane a few years ago even though they chose not to prepare. Their exact comments were like another person here who said do you know how much taxes I've paid in my life? I'm gonna get mine. That's why I've said we're doomed. I'm doing my best to procure as many tangible items that wI'll be beneficial to my family in the next depression/China enslavement of the US.

I'll be happy to banter about left v. right politics but it really doesn't matter any more.

It will literally take a dictatorship to fix it if it is going to be fixed...and the execution of most of the members of the federal Reserve and large banks and brokerage houses.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

When I think of oligarchs it reminds me of very rich Russian businessmen who wield a great deal of political influence. I guess this is a new term Americans will have to learn about the many American billionaires who control Trump and the GOP. Did we learn this from Russia or did they learn this from the U.S.?

And exactly who are those oligarchs?

 

[Shoeless]

The correct and moral thing to do is to cut spending and taxes. A 2:1 ratio would be a great starting point.

 

[2003TIDE]

The correct and moral thing to do is to cut spending and taxes. A 2:1 ratio would be a great starting point.

Moral? Why is that moral? We are at the point now where we have to cut spending and raise taxes otherwise we will never get out of this hole

 

[GrayTide]

And exactly who are those oligarchs?

To name just a few:

http://www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/reich/article/The-triumph-of-the-American-oligarchs-12442259.php

 

[Aledinho]

And exactly who are those oligarchs?

 

[Shoeless]

Moral? Why is that moral? We are at the point now where we have to cut spending and raise taxes otherwise we will never get out of this hole

Ok. Let's cut spending and lower taxes at a 10:1 ratio.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

To name just a few:

http://www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/reich/article/The-triumph-of-the-American-oligarchs-12442259.php

I'm sorry I wasn't clear. You referenced Russian oligarchs as a comparison. I was curious as to who the Russian oligarchs are.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

I'm sorry I wasn't clear. You referenced Russian oligarchs as a comparison. I was curious as to who the Russian oligarchs are.

I have a hard time keeping those multi-syllable jawbreaker names straight...

 

[MattinBama]

I'm sorry I wasn't clear. You referenced Russian oligarchs as a comparison. I was curious as to who the Russian oligarchs are.

Here's a few:

http://www.newsweek.com/trump-russia-oligarchs-real-estate-florida-715733

Also:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_oligarch

 

[GrayTide]

I feel like it has always been like this here. Who'd ya think wanted to declare independence? Many of the people with significant holdings in this country.

Agree. I am sure there have been American oligarchs throughout the history of this country. I suppose the era of the Internet and social media has provided a platform to "unmask" who these people are. As usual it is about the money and the political clout it buys these people. I am of the opinion it will never change and the working class will always be held subservient to these people and the US government.

 

[Displaced Bama Fan]

Agree. I am sure there have been American oligarchs throughout the history of this country. I suppose the era of the Internet and social media has provided a platform to "unmask" who these people are. As usual it is about the money and the political clout it buys these people. I am of the opinion it will never change and the working class will always be held subservient to these people and the US government.

Their names are Morgan, Chase, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Warburg, etc.