Who’s leading QB1 race in Spring practice?
- Thread starter BAMAfan777
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Yeah, the "scary good" at running the ball is probably THE reason Saban is going to give him every opportunity to win the job. But he HAS TO get above 59% pass completion % for it to even matter. He's scary good at running the ball but he's not good enough to be less than 60% and win.
I finally got a chance to watch one of the YouTube vids of the game that basically cut from one play to the next. I really want to watch the SEC Network so I can have a little time to process and see replays.
I agree that the job was not won by either JM or TS, but I think anybody thinking it would be clear-cut was a little misguided. At this point of their development it would probably take one of them falling flat on the faces during A-day and I didn't think either of them did that.
To be honest, I thought JM looked better than the commentary I'd read in this thread and the A-Day Game thread. He had some very nice passes and obviously flashed with his running ability on that first TD. I was interested in what I think I heard from Jordan Rogers when he asked JM how far he could throw it and he said at least 80 and maybe 95 (did I hear that right?). At any rate, it's obvious JM has a powerful arm, but my untrained eye sees three major problems: First, he has no touch. It's kinda the Freddie Kitchens syndrome. His short to intermediate passes have a weird giddy up to them. It's like if he's not throwing it hard he has bad fundamentals or something. Second, he's abhorrently inaccurate at times. I mean, he might miss a receiver on a short route by 2 or 3 yards. Third, and this may be the worst of the problems, he seems to be a "one read QB." If the read is open he throws a pretty decent ball. Somebody would have to analyze all his throws but of his 19 completions I'd bet over half were 1st read targets. Again, overall I thought he looked "decent" (except for the terrible INT at midfield). I'd say he didn't lose his spot as QB1a.
This was really the first opportunity to see Ty Simpson in live college action. I already knew he had wheels from his HS tapes, but I was pretty impressed with his scrambling. It honestly probably hurts JM's chances that TS is pretty mobile too given that's probably JM's best strength. As for Ty's arm, I was fairly impressed. It's plenty strong enough and as far as his throwing motion there's really no comparison. He looks like a QB playing QB and JM looks like an athlete playing QB. Ty has the better fundamentals and can also already go through his progressions pretty decently. He also throws a much more catchable ball IMO on his short to intermediate passes. IMO he has better accuracy and touch on his passes than JM. I think he's got a decided advantage over JM simply because he's got a better tool box of skills but for now, he's probably still considered QB1b.
CNS probably loves it's not apparent just yet.
I agree that the job was not won by either JM or TS, but I think anybody thinking it would be clear-cut was a little misguided. At this point of their development it would probably take one of them falling flat on the faces during A-day and I didn't think either of them did that.
To be honest, I thought JM looked better than the commentary I'd read in this thread and the A-Day Game thread. He had some very nice passes and obviously flashed with his running ability on that first TD. I was interested in what I think I heard from Jordan Rogers when he asked JM how far he could throw it and he said at least 80 and maybe 95 (did I hear that right?). At any rate, it's obvious JM has a powerful arm, but my untrained eye sees three major problems: First, he has no touch. It's kinda the Freddie Kitchens syndrome. His short to intermediate passes have a weird giddy up to them. It's like if he's not throwing it hard he has bad fundamentals or something. Second, he's abhorrently inaccurate at times. I mean, he might miss a receiver on a short route by 2 or 3 yards. Third, and this may be the worst of the problems, he seems to be a "one read QB." If the read is open he throws a pretty decent ball. Somebody would have to analyze all his throws but of his 19 completions I'd bet over half were 1st read targets. Again, overall I thought he looked "decent" (except for the terrible INT at midfield). I'd say he didn't lose his spot as QB1a.
This was really the first opportunity to see Ty Simpson in live college action. I already knew he had wheels from his HS tapes, but I was pretty impressed with his scrambling. It honestly probably hurts JM's chances that TS is pretty mobile too given that's probably JM's best strength. As for Ty's arm, I was fairly impressed. It's plenty strong enough and as far as his throwing motion there's really no comparison. He looks like a QB playing QB and JM looks like an athlete playing QB. Ty has the better fundamentals and can also already go through his progressions pretty decently. He also throws a much more catchable ball IMO on his short to intermediate passes. IMO he has better accuracy and touch on his passes than JM. I think he's got a decided advantage over JM simply because he's got a better tool box of skills but for now, he's probably still considered QB1b.
CNS probably loves it's not apparent just yet.
Gotta add “ignore the time clock” for Les to approveLes Miles approves this post
At first I was like “You expect us to believe they already filmed the sequel and are releasing it only a year later? What is this, Lord of the Rings?”Agreed.
But man, we saw this movie last fall, and so far the previews for the sequel are indicating that the plot hasn't changed very much.
(I know, I went pretty far with that metaphor
And then I remembered who Saban is…
Just me but I don't consider it to be a small things. Simpson was taught throwing mechanics from the time he could pick up a football. Milroe clearly never had that training.
Milroe just doesn’t seem to throw a “catchable ball” to my eyes. I just feel like Simpson gives us the best chance to win.
I finally was able to watch the A-Day game and here are my takeaways:
The quarterback play looked a lot better than the commentary I read around the "internets". I guess the bar was set so low by what I read that it made it not look as bad as it actually was! LOL!
Jalen Milroe:
Pros:
* MY GOD AT THE BURST OF SPEED! LOL! If he gets out of the pocket you can go ahead and give him 10 yards. "Ain't nobody" keeping him under 10 yards if he breaks the pocket.
* Stayed in the pocket a lot better than I expected. My expectations were that the split second he didn't see a WR open he'd tuck and go. But he didn't, he tried to scan the field and find a WR before scrambling
* Threw some dang good passes and has plenty of zip on the ball
* He COMMANDS the defense's respect and attention on every play that he doesn't hand the ball off. When he didn't directly handoff the ball you could see all the LB's paying a lot of attention to him and maybe not getting into their spots as quickly.
Cons:
* Seems to struggle seeing/finding receivers beyond his first read
* Consistently inaccurate on top of "when he misses, HE MISSES", meaning it's not close
* Lack of touch on balls that don't need to be thrown like a 4-seam fastball
Ty Simpson:
Pros:
* He is A LOT better athlete than I expected. Granted, he doesn't have the quickness and speed of Milroe but make no mistake about it, he can KILL YOU running the ball. Also, I don't know another quarterback other than Lamar Jackson that displays the running talent Milroe does. But it doesn't mean Simpson isn't an excellent athlete.
* Stayed in the pocket and read the field a lot better than I expected and better than the comments I read on the "internets"
* He threw some dang good passes and the int that Little got him on was just an amazing play, not anything Simpson did wrong. I watched that play over and over and I'm sorry, to tell that kid he put in the "wrong spot" would have been an injustice to him and just how great of a play Little made.
* He has the potential to be one helluva passer, the sideline pass in the first half to Burton was a dime and sick accurate (On your tv screen going right to left and to the left sideline).
Cons:
* Doesn't come off his first WR quick enough, better than Milroe, but still stays on him too long
* Has some accuracy issues that need to be fixed
* As with Milroe, needs to work on touch when he doesn't need a 4-seam fastball
I'm not going to give the same breakdown for the two Freshmen Holstein and Lonergan. But I will say we are COMPLETELY good at QB if either one or both of them hang around. Both showed a lot of good stuff for Freshmen. Lonergan had the better day, but Holstein was better than what I was told by some who watched the game before me. As the game went on the better he got. But they both are going to be very, very good college quarterbacks.
The quarterback play looked a lot better than the commentary I read around the "internets". I guess the bar was set so low by what I read that it made it not look as bad as it actually was! LOL!
Jalen Milroe:
Pros:
* MY GOD AT THE BURST OF SPEED! LOL! If he gets out of the pocket you can go ahead and give him 10 yards. "Ain't nobody" keeping him under 10 yards if he breaks the pocket.
* Stayed in the pocket a lot better than I expected. My expectations were that the split second he didn't see a WR open he'd tuck and go. But he didn't, he tried to scan the field and find a WR before scrambling
* Threw some dang good passes and has plenty of zip on the ball
* He COMMANDS the defense's respect and attention on every play that he doesn't hand the ball off. When he didn't directly handoff the ball you could see all the LB's paying a lot of attention to him and maybe not getting into their spots as quickly.
Cons:
* Seems to struggle seeing/finding receivers beyond his first read
* Consistently inaccurate on top of "when he misses, HE MISSES", meaning it's not close
* Lack of touch on balls that don't need to be thrown like a 4-seam fastball
Ty Simpson:
Pros:
* He is A LOT better athlete than I expected. Granted, he doesn't have the quickness and speed of Milroe but make no mistake about it, he can KILL YOU running the ball. Also, I don't know another quarterback other than Lamar Jackson that displays the running talent Milroe does. But it doesn't mean Simpson isn't an excellent athlete.
* Stayed in the pocket and read the field a lot better than I expected and better than the comments I read on the "internets"
* He threw some dang good passes and the int that Little got him on was just an amazing play, not anything Simpson did wrong. I watched that play over and over and I'm sorry, to tell that kid he put in the "wrong spot" would have been an injustice to him and just how great of a play Little made.
* He has the potential to be one helluva passer, the sideline pass in the first half to Burton was a dime and sick accurate (On your tv screen going right to left and to the left sideline).
Cons:
* Doesn't come off his first WR quick enough, better than Milroe, but still stays on him too long
* Has some accuracy issues that need to be fixed
* As with Milroe, needs to work on touch when he doesn't need a 4-seam fastball
I'm not going to give the same breakdown for the two Freshmen Holstein and Lonergan. But I will say we are COMPLETELY good at QB if either one or both of them hang around. Both showed a lot of good stuff for Freshmen. Lonergan had the better day, but Holstein was better than what I was told by some who watched the game before me. As the game went on the better he got. But they both are going to be very, very good college quarterbacks.
Well, I like where we are at this stage in the game. Great players all over the field but no overhype. Coordinators seem to be solid and indications are that Steele is making an early impact. Good stuff heading into the Summer and really hope ALL of our QBs find whisperers to help them through independent workouts. Very optimistic.
I think it's been said already, but I think we've been spoiled with such good QB play for a few years we have some unrealistic expectations when breaking in a new starter! Then it didn't help when along came BY who stepped into the starting roll and succeeded as easily as I can eat half a bag of Doritos in one setting.
It seems we are expecting JM or TS to be able to step in and perform just as easily as BY did and we should know that's not the way it usually works.
Shoot, it took (for various reasons that have been debated) Tua all season long to finally get his shot in 2017! It took Jalen Hurts 3-4 years to develop!!! And remember how Mac Jones looked woefully unprepared at the end of the season when Tau got hurt against Auburn? Who saw Mac Jones having the magical season he had in 2020? But remember he'd been in the program 4 years then!
I don't think the QB situation is nearly as bleak as some are thinking.
It seems we are expecting JM or TS to be able to step in and perform just as easily as BY did and we should know that's not the way it usually works.
Shoot, it took (for various reasons that have been debated) Tua all season long to finally get his shot in 2017! It took Jalen Hurts 3-4 years to develop!!! And remember how Mac Jones looked woefully unprepared at the end of the season when Tau got hurt against Auburn? Who saw Mac Jones having the magical season he had in 2020? But remember he'd been in the program 4 years then!
I don't think the QB situation is nearly as bleak as some are thinking.
After watching the Spring game I'm confident our QB situation will work itself out and both will develop enough for us to make a title run. Let's also not forget, the quarterbacks we've had that were deemed "Elite" (Young and Tua) never won a national title as the starting quarterback. All of our titles have been won by guys who came with a lot of criticism.
IMO Ty Simpson will be QB1 in the fall. JM will be the capable back-up again if he stays, but I like what I saw from Lonergan and think he should get a lot more reps than did Simpson last season. Our offensive strength should be the run game with the stable of RB's we have and utilizing TE's & RB's in the passing game much more than in recent past. At least I'm hoping that's the way this staff is leaning. WR's still need A LOT of development and maturity.
The wild card that will keep Milroe in the competition all the way down to Saban finally deciding is his explosiveness when he runs. IMO, Milroe will not have to improve as much in the passing game as Simpson will have to do to get the starting job. The type of freakish explosiveness he has looks very "Vick-ish" and a more recent example, Lamar Jackson-ish, and used the right way can completely wreck defenses. But it has to come with a minimal level of pass completion % that my guess would be very high 50's to low 60's. I don't think Ty Simpson has that leeway and win the job. But again, I could be completely wrong.
You can bet the coaching staff has lined up Milroe with someone to whisper his throwing mechanics into shape over the summer but yea, Simpson would be my bet if I were gambling today.
I think the dynamic you are describing is likely what will lead to the QB battle lasting into the season...perhaps well into the season. I agree TS's passing would have to improve more than JM's for him to win the starters role outright by Sept. 1.
Even as they are right now, however, I have more confidence in TS's arm than JM's. The sample size of A-day is pretty small, but Ty is a more fundamentally sound QB in the passing game.
Someone earlier said they could see our offense looking like Jalen Hurts' first year as starter. I think that's how it might look if JM starts. If I'm being honest, that scares me to death! Hurts' first year as a starter was the most frustrating year of offense I'd ever seen. When teams held Hurts' scrambling in check and took away his first read, our offense ground to a halt against decent defenses.
That's my fear with Milroe. We'll have games where we can't make first downs and put points on the board because we can't complete 3rd down attempts thru the air. If he starts and struggles this is when TS will probably win the job. If Jalen starts and demonstrates he can make plays with his arm as well as legs, he might not ever give up the position.
If you aren't at least somewhat nervous about quarterback play this year, then I think you aren't watching. We got spoiled with Jalen, Tua, Mac and Bryce. This year will be a major step down. Sayin is the real deal so I am hoping he sticks and competes for starter next year.
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