Question: Aliens--do they exist? (not the group Trump is fired up over)

[AUDub]

The only reason I see why someone would not believe in aliens is because they believe we evolved from some primordial goo or something. If you believe we were created then you certainly have to believe in aliens!

Any of you ever wonder if we actually are a product of evolution how come we require artificially made clothing and no other life form on this planet does? I mean we should by all intents and purposes have thick hide and fur if we are a product of natural selection.

I have no interest in turning this into an evolution debate, but wow. Some study on the matter would do you good.

 

[MDBSnare]

Wow! What intelligent insight....

Nope.


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[MOAN]

I have no interest in turning this into an evolution debate, but wow. Some study on the matter would do you good.

I'm always up for enlightenment, so please don't leave it at that! What should I be studying?

 

[Bamaro]

Wow! What intelligent insight....

I thought that at first too until I remembered the OPs original post:

Try to move beyond the goofies on History Channel's "Ancient Aliens". Do you think that we have been visited by intelligent life, not from Earth?

The thread title is a little misleading.

 

[RammerJammer14]

Wow! What intelligent insight....

Well I have a hard time taking such questions seriously. But if you want me to elaborate:

Literally the only "proof" there is for aliens is the fact that the universe is huge. Even then, the probabilities of there being life on another planet are very slim. Much less intelligent life.

And then on top of that you want to tell me that aliens have been secretly visiting earth, abducting people, doing weird experiments on them, then returning them to their homes none the wiser. To what end? I mean not once have they popped in to say hi, or given us the key to unlimited energy or anything.

Which brings me to my next point. If alien life exists, why do people automatically assume it is so ridiculously more advanced than ours? There is zero reason to believe that. Zero.

The humility in regards to the human race is nice, but misplaced imo. There is just as much evidence that we are living in the Matrix as there is for aliens visiting Earth.

I've said it in the past and I will say it again. I think it is a little more than coincidental that the dawn of space flight and the creation of secret government aerospace experimentation programs coincided with the explosion of UFO sightings around these same secret aerospace facilities.


But what do I know. I'm sure the government has really just been trying to harness the energy of intergalactic spirit aliens in order to establish a tyrannical dictatorship known as the "New World Order".

At least we had a documentary film crew uncover the inner workings of the Matrix.


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[mittman]

you have been watching Predator way too many times.

To be fair, if the have traveled here by definition they more advanced and probably a great deal scarier than us.

That said, until someone finds a huge hole in the ice leading to a temple filled with acid blooded monsters for the hunting pleasure of a huge Rastafarian insect looking creature I'm not going to worry about it too much

 

[AUDub]

I'm always up for enlightenment, so please don't leave it at that! What should I be studying?

Alright. Because you asked, I'll parse it. We'll leave it at that though. We could start a thread on the matter to discuss it further.

The only reason I see why someone would not believe in aliens is because they believe we evolved from some primordial goo or something. If you believe we were created then you certainly have to believe in aliens!

If we are to assume that abiogenesis is a natural process, then the possibility that it has or can occur elsewhere in the universe would logically follow.

Any of you ever wonder if we actually are a product of evolution how come we require artificially made clothing and no other life form on this planet does? I mean we should by all intents and purposes have thick hide and fur if we are a product of natural selection.

We don't "require" clothes at all. We wear them for utility and because of societal norms.

And no, it's likely we lack fur because it conferred an evolutionary advantage at some point in the past. Natural selection led to our loss of fur.

 

[CajunCrimson]

I have no interest in turning this into an evolution debate, but wow. Some study on the matter would do you good.

All education has done for you, as far as I can tell, is turn you into a fairly unpleasant posting troll......

I'm sure Moan can defend himself, but it sure gets old to see you constantly trying to be "that guy" who always tries to belittle others......

I'll confess, I'm ignorant about many issues of the world.....however, figuring that most items that are of intellectual disagreement tend to be complicated, simply because a little edumacation tends to do more damage than having no information at all......

Some (Von Daniken - for example) believe that "God" is from a highly-advanced "Alien" race that colonized earth by supplying "The Missing Link" -- so, Moan's opinion of our planet does have some merit, and to dismiss it the way you did, was pretty obnoxious.....

 

[MOAN]

Well I have a hard time taking such questions seriously. But if you want me to elaborate:

Literally the only "proof" there is for aliens is the fact that the universe is huge. Even then, the probabilities of there being life on another planet are very slim. Much less intelligent life.

Witness testimony is not "proof" of anything I suppose, so why do our court systems even use it? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWUCDHofEho

And then on top of that you want to tell me that aliens have been secretly visiting earth, abducting people, doing weird experiments on them, then returning them to their homes none the wiser. To what end? I mean not once have they popped in to say hi, or given us the key to unlimited energy or anything.

It would seem to me that alien experimentation would help explain some of the crazies in our world today but what do I know? I have seen UFO's personally which I suppose could mean anything, hallucination, secret government experimental craft, I do not know thats why it was a UFO. I can tell you for sure it wasn't anything I have ever seen or heard before thats all.

Which brings me to my next point. If alien life exists, why do people automatically assume it is so ridiculously more advanced than ours? There is zero reason to believe that. Zero.

If it is visiting us it would have to be more advanced than us but that is a mute point to you as there is no proof of it happening.

The humility in regards to the human race is nice, but misplaced imo. There is just as much evidence that we are living in the Matrix as there is for aliens visiting Earth.

Maybe we are living in a Matrix or a Hologram? I can't prove either but I don't so easily dismiss it. All any of us know or think we know is confined to our senses in the brain and even that is debatable to what is real. No two brains see exactly alike so what seems real to one may be different to another. Proving something is not always an easy task even for the most simple of things. The old ten people witness a car accident and giving ten differing accounts of how it happened deal.

I've said it in the past and I will say it again. I think it is a little more than coincidental that the dawn of space flight and the creation of secret government aerospace experimentation programs coincided with the explosion of UFO sightings around these same secret aerospace facilities.

No doubt that would explain a lot of UFO sightings. The government has investigated thousands of claims, but even then there was a good bit of unexplained sightings. Maybe there is a secret aerospace facility here in North Alabama besides the open space program facilities we all know about. Of course proving that is another hurdle in of itself. But I won't count out the possibility.

But what do I know. I'm sure the government has really just been trying to harness the energy of intergalactic spirit aliens in order to establish a tyrannical dictatorship known as the "New World Order".

At least we had a documentary film crew uncover the inner workings of the Matrix.

What do any of us really know? Evolutionist have their theories, Creationist the same, as well as Ufologist. Personally I prescribe to my theory that all three have their merits and that we could be a product of evolution, created by genetic manipulation by a superior race of beings, whom most call God and many call aliens.

You ever heard of the Cambrian Explosion, the relatively short evolutionary event, beginning around 542 million years ago, during which most major animal phyla appeared, as indicated by the fossil record? It lasted between 20-25 million years, which is a long time indeed, but nothing compared to the time before it where only simple organisms composed of individual cells occasionally organized into colonies existed. Charles Darwin even discussed it as one of the main objections that could be made against the theory of evolution by natural selection. Could this event have been speeded up or manipulated by genetic manipulation from an advanced alien race? I suppose until they come down here and admit to it we will never know and even then there will be doubters.

 

[AUDub]

All education has done for you, as far as I can tell, is turn you into a fairly unpleasant posting troll......

Oh, look. Cajun has once again turned up to make me the subject.

I'm sure Moan can defend himself, but it sure gets old to see you constantly trying to be "that guy" who always tries to belittle others......

I'm not belittling Moan. Moan has some misconceptions I'd like to see cleared up is all.

I'll confess, I'm ignorant about many issues of the world.....however, figuring that most items that are of intellectual disagreement tend to be complicated, simply because a little edumacation tends to do more damage than having no information at all......

"Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'

-Isaac Asimov

​

Some (Von Daniken - for example) believe that "God" is from a highly-advanced "Alien" race that colonized earth by supplying "The Missing Link" -- so, Moan's opinion of our planet does have some merit, and to dismiss it the way you did, was pretty obnoxious.....

Von Daniken's idea is harebrained. Just because some yahoo published some pseudoscientific bunk does not lend an idea merit. You might as well be citing Ancient Aliens.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

 

[CajunCrimson]

I'm not belittling Moan. Moan has some misconceptions I'd like to see cleared up is all.

No offense, but who the Hell are you to clear it up? Did I miss hearing about your credentials?

What you don't understand, is that...,.healthy debate is fun, argumentativeness can actually be an attractive quality in someone.....

You don't debate, you demean.....and attempt to try to make someone look stupid.....

You better be coming with some serious credibility to pull that off.....most of the time, you look like a troll....

And.....that was my attempt at "trying to clear that up".....

Do you have proof that Von Daniken is wrong? And his work was produced many decades before Yahoo....

Not saying Von Daniken is right.....he certainly wasn't a Christian.....but, figuring that no one knows the truth....then any attempt at explaining the un-explainable, to me, is interesting.....

People thought Star Trek was "harebrained" too.......

 

[AUDub]

No offense, but who the Hell are you to clear it up? Did I miss hearing about your credentials?

Not sure why my cred is important. I'd prefer to let my arguments stand on their own merits. Since you've asked; I've mentioned in the past I claim an engineering degree. I have a BSEE. I also have an AAS and Certificate in Biomedical Engineering Technology. I am a Clinical Engineer by trade, and have worked as a lab technician and a Biomed tech. I have good understanding of human anatomy and physiology and evolutionary biology, but I do not claim expertise in either of these fields.

What you don't understand, is that...,.healthy debate is fun, argumentativeness can actually be an attractive quality in someone.....

You don't debate, you demean.....and attempt to try to make someone look stupid.....

You better be coming with some serious credibility to pull that off.....most of the time, you look like a troll....

And.....that was my attempt at "trying to clear that up".....

I suppose saying something you said is wrong and recommending you look further into the matter could be demeaning. You know, if you're a whiny little baby that doesn't handle criticism well or something.

Do you have proof that Von Daniken is wrong? And his work was produced many decades before Yahoo....

It's not my job to prove him wrong. It's his job to prove himself right. The burden of proof is his. Remember, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Not saying Von Daniken is right.....he certainly wasn't a Christian.....but, figuring that no one knows the truth....then any attempt at explaining the un-explainable, to me, is interesting.....

You're supposed to go where the evidence takes you. Aren't you a logic based thinker?

People thought Star Trek was "harebrained" too.......

I love Star Trek. Watched TNG for years. But it's fiction.

If we figure how out to how to make a Matter-Antimatter reactor in a dilithium matrix, I'll be impressed.

 

[CajunCrimson]

Not sure why my cred is important. I'd prefer to let my arguments stand on their own merits. Since you've asked; I've mentioned in the past I claim an engineering degree. I have a BSEE. I also have an AAS and Certificate in Biomedical Engineering Technology. I am a Clinical Engineer by trade, and have worked as a lab technician and a Biomed tech. I have good understanding of human anatomy and physiology and evolutionary biology, but I do not claim expertise in either of these fields.



I suppose saying you something you said is wrong and recommending you look further into the matter could be demeaning. You know, if you're a whiny little baby that doesn't handle criticism well or something.



It's not my job to prove him wrong. It's his job to prove himself right. The burden of proof is his. Remember, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
.

I guess it's a generational thing.....

It is your job to prove him wrong....IF YOU SAY HE'S WRONG.....otherwise, why say it.....?

Also, it's not what you say......it's your charming method of how you do it.....you don't have a clue how to debate....because you aren't interested in exchanging ideas. You think winning a debate is annoying someone to the point to where they quit trying to communicate.

I'm also guessing I'm not the first one to share this bit of wisdom with you......

It's a common liberal trait.....you just have it worse than others on here. At least seebell and some of the others have a certain level of charm and personality....and are quite likable.....

You...on the other hand....are not.

I'm so glad you are a barner.....

By the way.....I've been annoyed to the point to where I won't reply to this one.....so, have at it......give me 17 reasons why you are smarter than everyone....I'll be so excited to never read it.

 

[AUDub]

I guess it's a generational thing.....

It is your job to prove him wrong....IF YOU SAY HE'S WRONG.....otherwise, why say it.....?

I called the idea harebrained and pseudoscientific bunk, and that's exactly what it is. There's no real evidence there to support that silly idea.

I'm not going to lend credence to such an off the wall idea without a darned good reason to do so. There's a reason Occam's Razor and methodological naturalism are core tenets of the sciences.

Also, it's not what you say......it's your charming method of how you do it.....you don't have a clue how to debate....because you aren't interested in exchanging ideas. You think winning a debate is annoying someone to the point to where they quit trying to communicate.

I'm also guessing I'm not the first one to share this bit of wisdom with you......

You are, actually.

It's a common liberal trait.....you just have it worse than others on here. At least seebell and some of the others have a certain level of charm and personality....and are quite likable.....

You...on the other hand....are not.

I'm so glad you are a barner.....

I really don't give a rip what you think about me.

By the way.....I've been annoyed to the point to where I won't reply to this one.....so, have at it......give me 17 reasons why you are smarter than everyone....I'll be so excited to never read it.

You've said that before and were replying again soon enough, so pardon me if I take it with a grain of salt.

 

[OreBama]

In regards to Cajun and Audub: Jerry, Jerry, Jerry!

 

[Really Big Bama Fan]

Try to move beyond the goofies on History Channel's "Ancient Aliens". Do you think that we have been visited by intelligent life, not from Earth?

I'm not sure about potential visitation of Earth. Aliens would need to live a very long time to travel between stars at subluminal speeds. On the other hand, it is intriguing to see some of the pareidolia images from planetary probes, and data such as the potential Megastructures detected by the Kepler Space Telescope, or the "WOW! Signal" seen by the Big Ear radio telescope. Perhaps it is just best to recall the words from Hamlet: "There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

 

[KentuckianaBFan]

I'm not sure about potential visitation of Earth. Aliens would need to live a very long time to travel between stars at subluminal speeds. On the other hand, it is intriguing to see some of the pareidolia images from planetary probes, and data such as the potential Megastructures detected by the Kepler Space Telescope, or the "WOW! Signal" seen by the Big Ear radio telescope. Perhaps it is just best to recall the words from Hamlet: "There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

Assuming their propulsion capability is no better than ours...if they have been or are here, they would have much better technology than us...

 

[crimson fan man]

Assuming their propulsion capability is no better than ours...if they have been or are here, they would have much better technology than us...

I agree with this. If they have come a great distance to come here they are way ahead of us. I have seen two things in my life that I cannot explain and both times were with other people. One of the times I was told by a person there that if I mention seeing this object he would not agree that he seen it. Don't know if it was government or what but I can say it would make you question it. My life is not ruled by these events because what if they are aliens, what difference will it make if I can't prove it.

 

[MOAN]

I'm still waiting on proof that proves my theory, belief, wrong? I have searched the net for why humans do not have fur as animals, that we were supposedly evolved from, and all I have read or seen is guesses. Proving evolution is just as hard as proving god exist if not more so. I know AUDub believes my ideas are hairbrained and his a stroke of genius. Hell he could be correct I don't know. From what I gather my 141 IQ is supposedly borderline genius but I can't prove it either way, nor prove that I have a 141 IQ.

Believe whatever the hell you want is my motto!!

 

[crimson fan man]

I'm still waiting on proof that proves my theory, belief, wrong? I have searched the net for why humans do not have fur as animals, that we were supposedly evolved from, and all I have read or seen is guesses. Proving evolution is just as hard as proving god exist if not more so. I know AUDub believes my ideas are hairbrained and his a stroke of genius. Hell he could be correct I don't know. From what I gather my 141 IQ is supposedly borderline genius but I can't prove it either way, nor prove that I have a 141 IQ.

Believe whatever the hell you want is my motto!!

I don't know what the answer is but I can say look at the jump from the closest animal to humans and the gap in between. It is huge!! That is one of my biggest question on this subject, nothing in between. I can also say that my IQ is probably not very high because well I had to go to work at a very early age to take care of a family that was prematurely started because of misstates. Life is good because both sons are successful and my wife has a great career and all of them are college educated but me. I can live with that and also can say I do believe in Aliens to some point or another. Do I have proof, no but what I think on this subject is as good as any on this planet.