Taxes

[Tidewater]

I was chatting with someone at work today and I said something that might lead to a good idea.
Total the tax dollars you sent to federal, state and local. Then allow the taxpayer to shift $1,000 of the total from any once to any other level of government. As long as the total comes out to what it was to begin with.
Me personally, I would shift the entire $1,000 from federal to my city (cities in Virginia are (almost) entirely independent of the counties where they lay, so many city is my county).
My city spends like a tightfisted bunch and I would like to pay cops, teachers, garbage collectors, & firefighters more.
The federal government can stand to lose some weight.
Thoughts?

 

[Jon]

I was chatting with someone at work today and I said something that might lead to a good idea.
Total the tax dollars you sent to federal, state and local. Then allow the taxpayer to shift $1,000 of the total from any once to any other level of government. As long as the total comes out to what it was to begin with.
Me personally, I would shift the entire $1,000 from federal to my city (cities in Virginia are (almost) entirely independent of the counties where they lay, so many city is my county).
My city spends like a tightfisted bunch and I would like to pay cops, teachers, garbage collectors, & firefighters more.
The federal government can stand to lose some weight.
Thoughts?

Every year or once, I'm not clear. Once it is not a bad idea, every year would lead to lots of bad behavior I'd think.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

We gotta do something.

American-style tax rates with increasing demands for European-style benefits.....the numbers just don't work. Plus, the general public has precious little understanding of the functions and duties of the various levels of government. To most, whether it's public schools, local surface streets, national defense or the CIA, it's all just, "the gubmunt."

 

[DzynKingRTR]

I vote that everyone pays taxes but me. Everybody wins.

 

[Go Bama]

I would give it locally. Our city got sued a few years back and the coffers are empty.

When you own a business, taxes are tough. Property taxes, tangible personal property taxes, payroll taxes, professional privilege tax, license fees, x-ray registration, quarterly estimated taxes, state taxes and probably others that are slipping my mind right now. When there is also an inventory to maintain cash flow becomes a serious problem at times.

So if we we want European benefits and the higher tax rates, I’ll just retire. The reason I never vote for Democrats is because as a rule, they want to provide more government services which I cannot afford to pay for. I suspect a lot of small businesses are at the brink of being tapped out. I’m fortunate to be at the end of my career because I didn’t enjoy working for a larger corporation. The quality of care suffered greatly.

 

[92tide]

I would give it locally. Our city got sued a few years back and the coffers are empty.

When you own a business, taxes are tough. Property taxes, tangible personal property taxes, payroll taxes, professional privilege tax, license fees, x-ray registration, quarterly estimated taxes, state taxes and probably others that are slipping my mind right now. When there is also an inventory to maintain cash flow becomes a serious problem at times.

So if we we want European benefits and the higher tax rates, I’ll just retire. The reason I never vote for Democrats is because as a rule, they want to provide more government services which I cannot afford to pay for. I suspect a lot of small businesses are at the brink of being tapped out. I’m fortunate to be at the end of my career because I didn’t enjoy working for a larger corporation. The quality of care suffered greatly.

this year was our first to have to deal with the quarterly estimated taxes. it is a pain.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

Andrew Yang doesn't stand a chance and his idea is different but I found it interesting.

[h=1]MAKING TAXES FUN[/h]

[h=4]As President, I will…[/h]

• Create a federal holiday on the date taxes are due.
• Provide a report to every taxpayer with a breakdown of where their tax dollars go (Social Security, military, medical research, etc.) with shared video stories of what their tax money makes possible.
• Allow each American to direct 1% of their taxes to a specific project, department or activity of government (e.g. Veterans Affairs, National Endowment for the Arts, etc.).
• Bring 2 taxpayers who filed their taxes early from each state to a celebration at the White House with members of Congress on Revenue Day.

 

[Go Bama]

this year was our first to have to deal with the quarterly estimated taxes. it is a pain.

It truly is.

And FWIW, I’ll either vote for a Democratic, probably Pete Buttigieg, or another Libertarian. I don’t want anyone to think there is any chance in hell I’d vote for Donald Trump.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

I would give it locally. Our city got sued a few years back and the coffers are empty.

When you own a business, taxes are tough. Property taxes, tangible personal property taxes, payroll taxes, professional privilege tax, license fees, x-ray registration, quarterly estimated taxes, state taxes and probably others that are slipping my mind right now. When there is also an inventory to maintain cash flow becomes a serious problem at times.

So if we we want European benefits and the higher tax rates, I’ll just retire. The reason I never vote for Democrats is because as a rule, they want to provide more government services which I cannot afford to pay for. I suspect a lot of small businesses are at the brink of being tapped out. I’m fortunate to be at the end of my career because I didn’t enjoy working for a larger corporation. The quality of care suffered greatly.

When discussing federal income taxes and the impact they have on the average taxpayer and small business. It cannot be discussed in a vacuum, like other taxing authorities don't exist.

-Sales Taxes
-Payroll Taxes
-Property Taxes
-Inventory Taxes
-Excise Taxes
-Business License renewals
-State Taxes
-City/Local Taxes
-Use Taxes
-Environmental Fees

It gets to a point where you feel like everyone has their hand in your pocket wanting "more". Hell, I'm already paying "more".

 

[TIDE-HSV]

this year was our first to have to deal with the quarterly estimated taxes. it is a pain.

That's the way I've had to pay my taxes for my entire adult life, as I did yesterday. The last time I had taxes withheld from a paycheck was May, 1963...

 

[92tide]

That's the way I've had to pay my taxes for my entire adult life, as I did yesterday. The last time I had taxes withheld from a paycheck was May, 1963...

we have both now.

 

[CharminTide]

I would give it locally. Our city got sued a few years back and the coffers are empty.

I imagine that would be a common choice. I have no doubt that New York and California residents would rather their tax dollars remain local than be sent to Mississippi.

 

[rjtide]

I was chatting with someone at work today and I said something that might lead to a good idea.
Total the tax dollars you sent to federal, state and local. Then allow the taxpayer to shift $1,000 of the total from any once to any other level of government. As long as the total comes out to what it was to begin with.
Me personally, I would shift the entire $1,000 from federal to my city (cities in Virginia are (almost) entirely independent of the counties where they lay, so many city is my county).
My city spends like a tightfisted bunch and I would like to pay cops, teachers, garbage collectors, & firefighters more.
The federal government can stand to lose some weight.
Thoughts?

how about replacing the entire concept of federal and state income taxes and enact the equivalent of a VAT....value added tax? Everyone who consumes ANYTHING gets taxed at a flat 15-17%? No one is immune from it. No more income taxes. No more separate sales tax. Add a VAT and keep property taxes. Keep property taxes local. Split the VAT where the feds keep half, state/local split the other half. I'd be interested in seeing how much it money it would generate.

 

[92tide]

here is a recent cbo blurb on vat, but i don't think anyone looks at is as replacing income taxes (state and federal), but in addition to our current system.

Impose a 5 Percent Value-Added Tax

 

[Tidewater]

how about replacing the entire concept of federal and state income taxes and enact the equivalent of a VAT....value added tax? Everyone who consumes ANYTHING gets taxed at a flat 15-17%? No one is immune from it. No more income taxes. No more separate sales tax. Add a VAT and keep property taxes. Keep property taxes local. Split the VAT where the feds keep half, state/local split the other half. I'd be interested in seeing how much it money it would generate.

I'm open to that. Heck, I'd be open to almost any change frm the system than delivers a federal budget that is $1 trillion underfunded.

My point in the OP was that, if I give my mayor $1,000 in tax money, I have a high degree of confidence that it won't be squandered on stupid crap. I know my mayor. I can place a bag of flaming dog poo on his doorstep if he is naughty. The local paper will report it when he wastes tax money.
All of those are less true for my governor.
With the federal government, I have no chance of meeting the president to petition him for anything. I have never met my Rep nor my Senators. And boy do they waste money.

 

[CharminTide]

how about replacing the entire concept of federal and state income taxes and enact the equivalent of a VAT....value added tax? Everyone who consumes ANYTHING gets taxed at a flat 15-17%? No one is immune from it. No more income taxes. No more separate sales tax. Add a VAT and keep property taxes. Keep property taxes local. Split the VAT where the feds keep half, state/local split the other half. I'd be interested in seeing how much it money it would generate.

VAT taxes are horribly regressive and should never replace the income tax to become the primary mode of collecting revenue. For a simplistic illustration: flat consumption taxes affect 100% of income for poor people, 80% of income for the middle class, and <10% of income for the rich. The disparate socioeconomic effects should be obvious.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

VAT taxes are horribly regressive and should never replace the income tax to become the primary mode of collecting revenue. For a simplistic illustration: flat consumption taxes affect 100% of income for poor people, 80% of income for the middle class, and <10% of income for the rich. The disparate socioeconomic effects should be obvious.

You could probably structure a progressive VAT tax.

Ben Cardin, one of Maryland's senators, has a plan that he calls "Progressive Consumption Tax." Idk if he is still pushing it or not. I haven't looked into it too much though it does sound interesting.

Here is some info from 2015...

[h=1]What is the Progressive Consumption Tax?[/h]

[h=1]An Analysis of Senator Cardin’s Progressive Consumption Tax[/h]

 

[92tide]

VAT taxes are horribly regressive and should never replace the income tax to become the primary mode of collecting revenue. For a simplistic illustration: flat consumption taxes affect 100% of income for poor people, 80% of income for the middle class, and <10% of income for the rich. The disparate socioeconomic effects should be obvious.

consumption taxes also follow the economy which would lead to lots of trouble in an economic downturn if they were the primary mode of revenue collection.

 

[CharminTide]

You could probably structure a progressive VAT tax.

Ben Cardin, one of Maryland's senators, has a plan that he calls "Progressive Consumption Tax." Idk if he is still pushing it or not. I haven't looked into it too much though it does sound interesting.

Here is some info from 2015...

[h=1]What is the Progressive Consumption Tax?[/h]

[h=1]An Analysis of Senator Cardin’s Progressive Consumption Tax[/h]

Interesting. I'd honestly need to see a formal analysis of this, because I'm skeptical that this would actually raise enough revenue to offset the loss of income taxation. And like 92 said, the federal budget may noticeably diminish during recessions when individual spending is down, which may be problematic. Still, it's interesting.

 

[jthomas666]

And like 92 said, the federal budget may noticeably diminish during recessions when individual spending is down, which may be problematic. Still, it's interesting.

Alabama's over-reliance on sales tax makes it very susceptible to recessions...