New OL Coach - Who would You Hire???

[Bamabuzzard]

When I was watching Miami during the game last night, all I could think to myself was "If we had this o-line and RB play, we probably would have run the table."

Indiana's running backs ran with a much different type of effort than our backs. They ran with relentlessness and did it literally every snap. They hit the LOS hard whether a hole was there or not.

 

[KrAzY3]

However unintentional, this (the bolded part) is a very misleading stat. There was a significant difference in games played between SEC programs this season. Alabama was 8th in the SEC (bottom of the upper half of the conference) this year. It’s even more meaningful to calculate “sacks per pass attempt” where Alabama was 5th or possibly 4th (at least after the AU game) in the truer measure of that stat.

So, the reality is that Alabama’s OL was one of the better pass blocking OLs in the SEC this year. It’s probably a little better than that when we factor in the RB responsibilities. E.g., in the first OU game 2 of the 4 sacks were the RBs (1 each for Miller and Hill) responsibility. That is the only game whose stats re: the RBs I know. But I know there were other RB pass blocking failures.

Another observation from just watching on TV, is that most SEC QBs are often under siege by the SEC pass rushers. And that is with the vast majority of the teams having very mobile QBs. Mendoza was sacked twice by Alabama, Ty was not sacked, though Mack was.

Finally, the vast majority of serious football fans think their OLs are terrible and hate their OL coach.

In summary: Alabama’s OL was an above average pass blocking OL, at least related to the rest of the SEC.

Let's make this clear. Alabama's pass blocking wasn't good enough for what they were trying to do. If you're going to be pass happy like DeBoer's scheme tries to do, you need to keep your quarterback's jersey clean. If you're going to focus on pass protection at the expensive of run blocking (this was noted earlier in the season, that pass protection was the emphasis) you need to be very good at it. Not a bit above average, one of the best.

That was not the case. I have outlined why I think Alabama has to be more committed to the run, I've said that this would be a problem prior to the start of the season and this offense was the 49th ranked scoring offense. I have to go all the way back to 2007 to find an Alabama offense this bad. So clearly, there's a problem. Especially since they hired DeBoer as an offensive guy and this is the worst offense Alabama has had since Major Applewhite was the OC.

Having said that, I haven't screamed for them to get rid of the OC or fire the OL coach into the sun or something. But clearly, there needs to be changes and looking at the roster, they decided running backs were not the problem. So, coaching it is then!

I've already described why you basically need to try to keep Kap and Grubb though, so what do you do? If you do nothing, this could put DeBoer on the hot seat. One possibility, I guess could be let Kap stay with the exterior, as you noted it wasn't that bad. Then because Grubb doesn't recruit or coach another position group, he could work with the interior on run blocking. That's in theory in his wheelhouse, their run blocking certainly couldn't get much worse.

Then, to keep it from being a demotion, you could make Kap run game coordinator. No idea if he's good or not, but it's a thing he's done in the past. Certainly not teaching good run blocking, but doesn't mean he can't be a solid run game coordinator. The key here though would just be the emphasis. If Kap is spending time doing that, and basically having a two heads are better than one approach with Grubb (not like people loved Grubb's run play calling anyway), then may be they can develop a run game.

Mind you, I get why some people are saying just do a clean slate. But, something has to change... it's clearly not working.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

Let's make this clear. Alabama's pass blocking wasn't good enough for what they were trying to do. If you're going to be pass happy like DeBoer's scheme tries to do, you need to keep your quarterback's jersey clean. If you're going to focus on pass protection at the expensive of run blocking (this was noted earlier in the season, that pass protection was the emphasis) you need to be very good at it. Not a bit above average, one of the best.

That was not the case. I have outlined why I think Alabama has to be more committed to the run, I've said that this would be a problem prior to the start of the season and this offense was the 49th ranked scoring offense. I have to go all the way back to 2007 to find an Alabama offense this bad. So clearly, there's a problem. Especially since they hired DeBoer as an offensive guy and this is the worst offense Alabama has had since Major Applewhite was the OC.

Having said that, I haven't screamed for them to get rid of the OC or fire the OL coach into the sun or something. But clearly, there needs to be changes and looking at the roster, they decided running backs were not the problem. So, coaching it is then!

I've already described why you basically need to try to keep Kap and Grubb though, so what do you do? If you do nothing, this could put DeBoer on the hot seat. One possibility, I guess could be let Kap stay with the exterior, as you noted it wasn't that bad. Then because Grubb doesn't recruit or coach another position group, he could work with the interior on run blocking. That's in theory in his wheelhouse, their run blocking certainly couldn't get much worse.

Then, to keep it from being a demotion, you could make Kap run game coordinator. No idea if he's good or not, but it's a thing he's done in the past. Certainly not teaching good run blocking, but doesn't mean he can't be a solid run game coordinator. The key here though would just be the emphasis. If Kap is spending time doing that, and basically having a two heads are better than one approach with Grubb (not like people loved Grubb's run play calling anyway), then may be they can develop a run game.

Mind you, I get why some people are saying just do a clean slate. But, something has to change... it's clearly not working.

I really have no idea the direction CKD will go with any staff changes as it relates to the OL. There are options where he wouldn't have to get rid of Kap but just re-assign him. I just think if NOTHING is done and Kap remains in his current position, CKD is really rolling the dice on his tenure at Alabama. I could be wrong, but if makes a change at the OL position and it still doesn't improve, then at least it can be pointed to that he made a change, tried to get it right and it didn't work. Whereas, keeping the status quo and it not improving could really cause things to go south. Shula did the same thing, refused to make certain staff changes and it got him.

 

[GrayTide]

After reading all these threads about, getting a new OL coach, the quality of the portal signed players, and where we are going to be ranked in the preseason next year, has worn me out. I may make a complete break from college football until September, it just isn't fun any more with the Portal and NI. I will check in from time to time, but right now I really do not care what happens in college football. Ciao, y'all.

 

[squib]

Indiana's running backs quarter back ran with a much different type of effort than our backs.

FIFY

 

[Padreruf]

Jeff "Pancake" Saturday...he is available I do believe.

 

[gtgilbert]

Or the defense audibled to a play that negated ours?

Which means we were probably too "predictable."

Little of both and it's pretty similar to what happened with Tua. Once there was a decent amount of tape out there on our offense, DCs were able to 'bait' us. They figured out that if they showed us a certain look, what we were mostly likely to switch into. There was a segment with an NFL QB on that this season, talking about how good defenses have gotten at doing this to the point that everything had to be a super fast progression or multiple read situation.

 

[KrAzY3]

FIFY

Black was still really solid for them this post season and in the season in general.
4.3 against Ohio State
6.6 against Alabama
5.3 against Oregon
4.6 against Miami

That's remarkable consistency for a 2 star, #201 ranked RB coming out of high school, playing against some really good teams. You can tell he's been coached well.

 

[mlh]

I suspect that next year our QB will not have quite so much authority to change the play a the line...and that might be a good thing.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

I really have no idea the direction CKD will go with any staff changes as it relates to the OL. There are options where he wouldn't have to get rid of Kap but just re-assign him. I just think if NOTHING is done and Kap remains in his current position, CKD is really rolling the dice on his tenure at Alabama. I could be wrong, but if makes a change at the OL position and it still doesn't improve, then at least it can be pointed to that he made a change, tried to get it right and it didn't work. Whereas, keeping the status quo and it not improving could really cause things to go south. Shula did the same thing, refused to make certain staff changes and it got him.

We just made the playoff and finished the same as Georgia/Ohio State, but people still aren't happy, so it's really not gonna matter what he does tbh. I don't even think we're anywhere close to the point where it's "make changes or else". Some of the fans may not be happy, but there's only one question that matters: "Is Greg Byrne happy?" I think he is still very content with his hire, so I don't think we're at that point yet. I still expect an extension to get done this off-season.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

We just made the playoff and finished the same as Georgia/Ohio State, but people still aren't happy, so it's really not gonna matter what he does tbh. I don't even think we're anywhere close to the point where it's "make changes or else". Some of the fans may not be happy, but there's only one question that matters: "Is Greg Byrne happy?" I think he is still very content with his hire, so I don't think we're at that point yet. I still expect an extension to get done this off-season.

Everyone has their own standards and expectations. But, no, I'm not particularly happy with some of the things I saw this season and the trends that have now developed in the program after two years. I have no idea what is on Greg Byrne's mind but I'd wager he's not "very content" and isn't typing up an extension. There's no reason for an extension.

 

[KrAzY3]

Simply put, you don't bring in an offensive guru to have the worst offense Alabama has had in two decades.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

Everyone has their own standards and expectations. But, no, I'm not particularly happy with some of the things I saw this season and the trends that have now developed in the program after two years. I have no idea what is on Greg Byrne's mind but I'd wager he's not "very content" and isn't typing up an extension. There's no reason for an extension.

The word before the quarterfinal game was that they were working on an extension. Nothing has happened since then to change that, so odds are, they are still working on one. If id asked everyone on here before the season, most them would have said they'd be happy with an 11 win season and a playoff victory, but now it's suddenly not good enough. We are continuing to nail recruiting , so the results on the field are only going to get better as DeBoer continues to bring his guys in and along. Just gotta trust the process.

 

[KrAzY3]

now it's suddenly not good enough.

Losing four games by a combined 72 points was never good enough. One of those spankings came from Georgia, another came to a team that beat Ohio State by only 3, so no not the same as those teams.

No one, anywhere would have said that was an acceptable year two performance at Alabama. No one advocating for DeBoer was like sign me up for 4 losses per year, including at least one to a team with a losing record. Let's not pretend otherwise.

DeBoer's record without Penix at the FBS level now sits at 69.5%. No, that level of performance is not good enough. It's valid, as long as he fails to replicate it, to question what he owed his success at Washington to.

Now, I'm not saying fire him! I'm not, but yes things do need to change. Anyone who thinks things are right on schedule is just ignoring reality. I hope things can get better, I think they can get better, but they do need to get better!

 

[Bamabuzzard]

The word before the quarterfinal game was that they were working on an extension. Nothing has happened since then to change that, so odds are, they are still working on one. If id asked everyone on here before the season, most them would have said they'd be happy with an 11 win season and a playoff victory, but now it's suddenly not good enough. We are continuing to nail recruiting , so the results on the field are only going to get better as DeBoer continues to bring his guys in and along. Just gotta trust the process.

The extension talk quickly went away as soon as Michigan and Penn St hired a coach. Personally, I don't think there is an extension. I saw it on "X" one time but it wasn't from a reputable source. People are happy with an 11-2 regular season and a playoff win. I know I am. But there are things that took the shine off the 11-2 regular season and the playoff win. Getting blown out three times this year on big national games, the staff being incapable of even improving the OL's run blocking and the continued issues of having games where we look completely unprepared. This is the second year in a row that the team ended the season with a downward trajectory, the second season in a row where the team limped through the second half of the season and the second season in a row with four losses. Those things will never be accepted as part of a "good season" at Alabama.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

Losing four games by a combined 72 points was never good enough.

No one, anywhere would have said that was an acceptable year two performance. No one advocating for DeBoer was like sign me up for 4 losses per year, including at least one to a team with a losing record. Let's not pretend otherwise.

DeBoer's record without Penix at the FBS level now sits at 69.5%. No, that level of performance is not good enough, not for the resources he had and the talent he inherited.

Now, I'm not saying fire him! I'm not, but yes things do need to change. Anyone who is like right on schedule is just ignoring reality. No, I hope things can get better, I things can get better, but they do need to get better!

We could lose 4 games by a combined 500 and it wouldn't make any difference to me, as long as we are contending for a national championship, which we did. We were in the playoffs and won a playoff game, only to run into a buzzsaw. If you're gonna lose in the playoff, it might as well be to the team that won it.

DeBoer is the one who found Penix and developed him, so he must also get credit for that too. He's also about to have a QB who is going to end up being better than Penix, so that's not really concerning at all. Gotta give the man time to show what can do with his guys that fit his system. We shouldn't be worrying about whether we have the right coach. We should be using that time and energy on trying to figure out the NIL situation, which is a much more pressing matter.

 

[bamaga]

Jeff "Pancake" Saturday...he is available I do believe.

He already goes to games, his daughter is a student.

 

[KrAzY3]

DeBoer is the one who found Penix and developed him,

No he didn't. Penix was recruited to Indiana the year before DeBoer was hired as their OC. He just happened to be there at the same time as him, for one full year.

Penix played two more years for Indiana after DeBoer left. 2020 was when I actually became familiar with him, when he almost beat Ohio State by himself (491 yards, 5 TDs). That team still had Sheridan and Wommack by the way, that's where DeBoer encountered them as well. Didn't "find" they were already on staff when he was hired.

Guess we need to give credit to Tom Allen since he brought in Penix, Sheridan, Wommack and Deboer and put them all together.

We can go back and forth all we want on this, but there's no need to spin it. The proof will ultimately be in the results. I hope he does great, I want him to do great, but he has not as of yet done great. That's all there is to it.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

The extension talk quickly went away as soon as Michigan and Penn St hired a coach. Personally, I don't think there is an extension. I saw it on "X" one time but it wasn't from a reputable source. People are happy with an 11-2 regular season and a playoff win. I know I am. But there are things that took the shine off the 11-2 regular season and the playoff win. Getting blown out three times this year on big national games, the staff being incapable of even improving the OL's run blocking and the continued issues of having games where we look completely unprepared. This is the second year in a row that the team ended the season with a downward trajectory, the second season in a row where the team limped through the second half of the season and the second season in a row with four losses. Those things will never be accepted as part of a "good season" at Alabama.

The discussion may have gone away publicly, but if that was just a ploy to get him to stay, then thats a very shady way to do business. If they were in talks for an extension before, then they probably still are. That's probably the most important thing he could do, because we need to protect the program from the fans. If we run DeBoer out of town, then we may set the program back 10 years. If we are patient , and allow him to build the program in his image, we will have a national championship within 5 years, but probably no later than 3 years. Too much focus is being spent on HOW we got to 11 wins. When we are years removed from this, history is not going to remember the how. The history books are going to say 11 wins and a playoff victory. The rest is irrelevant. It took Ryan Day and Kirby Smart both 6 years to win a national championship. I don't even think it's gonna take DeBoer long, but as long as he's making the playoff every year, that should buy him at least 5 years imo.

 

[CrimsonTitles]

No he didn't. Penix was recruited to Indiana the year before DeBoer was hired as their OC. He just happened to be there at the same time as him, for one full year.

Penix played two more years for Indiana after DeBoer left. 2020 was when I actually became familiar with him, when he almost beat Ohio State by himself (491 yards, 5 TDs). That team still had Sheridan and Wommack by the way, that's where DeBoer encountered them as well. Didn't "find" they were already on staff when he was hired.

Guess we need to give credit to Tom Allen since he brought in Penix, Sheridan, Wommack and Deboer and put them all together.

We can go back and forth all we want on this, but there's no need to spin it. The proof will ultimately be in the results. I hope he does great, I want him to do great, but he has not as of yet done great. That's all there is to it.

Nick Sheridan found him (he was the primary recruiter according to 247), but DeBoer is the one who brought Sheridan here, so he'll just hire someone who can evaluate talent on a similar level. DeBoer, Grubb, and Sheridan developed Penix, with most of Penix's development coming directly under DeBoer. He was okay at Indiana. I remember him too, but he didn't become an All American level QB until he left Indiana.