ACC and PAC 12 Demise seems close (FSU officially stating intentions to fight ACC Grant of Rights… Clemson sues the ACC)

[Slowpoke Catracho]

And that's my point. People say not to take FSU and Clemson because the SEC is already in Florida and South Carolina. It doesn't matter if they add new states like it would have in the past, all that matters now is if they are going to draw viewership to ESPN or the SEC Network. Those channels can be accessed from anywhere in the world and they are trying to draw in large fanbases instead of large populaton areas. If they were going for population areas they might as well target Houston, Memphis, and those type of schools. Also, the focus is to much on just football and not what a school can offer in other sports.

For example, A school like Duke might not attract viewers in football, but you put them on those networks during basketball season and they draw and ESPN has to figure out how to get viewers from January until September when Football is not on and I think dismissing some of these schools as targets just because of football is short sighted.

FSU is top 20 in Viewership for College Football.

Which college football programs were the most-watched in 2022?

Michigan’s win over Ohio State was the most-watched regular-season college football game since 2011.

medium.com

 

[UAH]

I think they'd immediately be a top five-ish team in the SEC, and that ignores the inherent upgrades that would come quickly via SEC money / recruiting.

I'm no FSU fan, but I think they're a lot closer to being a contender than most realize.

Lived in the panhandle for a number of years and spent a lot of time in Tallahassee. It is a very nice friendly city with the campus in an attractive area near downtown. We all recognize Florida as a recruiting hot bed for high school athletes with Gainsville and Tallahasse being perhaps more attractive to parents than Miami or Clemson. With UF in a downcycle this is a particularly good time for FSU to become more attractive to athletes from the entire state of Florida, deep south Georgia and South Alabama. After getting to know so many people from FSU I am quite a fan of their turnaround. Clemson surely deserves having a top competitor in the conference.

 

[Redfish Hunter]

If the numbers in the TV rankings are an indicator, why would the SEC even consider adding anyone other than FSU and Clemson. Virginia, NC and all the other ACC schools have no viewership. For that matter neither does Oklahoma compared to all the other SEC schools.

 

[KrAzY3]

FSU and Clemson want out ( Clemson just not publicly saying like FSU) if the SEC does not grab both of them then the Big will ,they can't talk all about Oregon and Washington but they would take FSU, Clemson in a heartbeat, I don't care for it but it's the way sports is heading

Clemson is certainly more valuable to the Big 10, but I fail to see what great value they hold beyond recent success. It's the state of South Carolina, it's not exactly great recruiting territory, it's not an especially large state, even if the Big 10 wants to head south, they skip South Carolina and not really be missing much.

They don't even have the history of a Nebraska, but that's what adding them would be like to me. I think perhaps the Big 10 learned their lesson about adding one-trick ponies.

One element of all of this would be that in theory that territory holds bargaining power, but that would mean more territory holds more bargaining power. So for instance the west coast moves might offer more to the Big 10 because it's new territory than for instance adding programs like Pitt that are already in their footprint. Does South Carolina really do much for their footprint though? Virginia, North Carolina, and Florida all would do more in that regard.

If the numbers in the TV rankings are an indicator, why would the SEC even consider adding anyone other than FSU and Clemson. Virginia, NC and all the other ACC schools have no viewership. For that matter neither does Oklahoma compared to all the other SEC schools.

Why would they add Clemson then? Clemson's ratings are an aberration based on recent success everyone knows they won't maintain. That aside, you should look at basketball ratings, North Carolina absolutely dominates them and they reach into the millions to...

Why would people care so much about 3 million people watching a football game, but not care when 2.8 million tune in to watch North Carolina play a basketball game?

 

[JDCrimson]

The Big 10 adding Clemson does more for the Big 10 than Clemson imo. In short order heading North every other weekend Clemson's would be killed. See what it did to Nebraska. Plus Clemson fans would revolt.

If I'm the Big 10, I take Ga Tech and Miami. That's the North culture in the South. Clemson could dominate in the Big 12. Clemson is fools gold.

I would still prefer UNC, FSU, Uva, and Duke.

 

[81usaf92]

The Big 10 adding Clemson does more for the Big 10 than Clemson imo. In short order heading North every other weekend Clemson's would be killed. See what it did to Nebraska. Plus Clemson fans would revolt.

If I'm the Big 10, I take Ga Tech and Miami. That's the North culture in the South. Clemson could dominate in the Big 12. Clemson is fools gold.

I would still prefer UNC, FSU, Uva, and Duke.

I don’t know how Clemson does in the B1G, but one thing is for certain… They are really not attractive to either the SEC or the B1G. FSU, ND, UNC, and UVA are really the main attractions in the conference wars and it really puts teams like Clemson and Miami on edge because they may have to settle with the Big XII when it’s all said and done.

I think we will know who gets what when we find out the fate of Stanford. If Stanford is being wooed by the B1G then it pretty much signals that some package is being made for then ND, Washington, and Oregon. If not then it proves that the ACC is on shaky ground and that the super powers are waiting for something to happen.

 

[crimsonaudio]

AZ to the Big12? Looks like a done deal.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1687285212240027648

 

[tideindc]

I’m curious. Are folks here happy about the possible collapse of the ACC and PAC…or just commenting on which teams are most attractive to Big and SEC?
I still like having these different Power conferences in the sport. No interest in two giant conferences with no connection in terms of region or culture.

 

[crimsonaudio]

I’m curious. Are folks here happy about the possible collapse of the ACC and PAC…or just commenting on which teams are most attractive to Big and SEC?
I still like having these different Power conferences in the sport. No interest in two giant conferences with no connection in terms of region or culture.

I just comment on what I think is best of the option I think are available.

If it were up to me the SEC would still have 10 teams.

 

[81usaf92]

I just comment on what I think is best of the option I think are available.

If it were up to me the SEC would still have 10 teams.

i think the NCAA screwed up so badly with half butt plans like the BCS and the reaction to the Obannon case that it effectively killed the regionality of college football. After the Obannon case the jump to super conferences was probably the best path forward but ofcourse everyone sat on their hands and blindly trusted the ncaa.

Now it’s basically everyone trying to either escape to the SEC or B1G in order to stay fed. Mizzou, Vandy, Rutgers, and Maryland might be the biggest winners of the whole thing because now the big dogs are starting to sweat the future.

 

[81usaf92]

I’m curious. Are folks here happy about the possible collapse of the ACC and PAC…or just commenting on which teams are most attractive to Big and SEC?
I still like having these different Power conferences in the sport. No interest in two giant conferences with no connection in terms of region or culture.

When we tried to go to the BCS format and refused to tweak it to support regional appeal then it highlighted what some fans already knew from the start… college football is basically 6-7 teams that really matter and all but maybe 1 is east of the Rio Grande. The bowls suffered and people only cared about a handful of games which the SEC and B1G dominated them.

The PAC 12 was mostly kept relevant because of their cultural ties to the B1G and the ACC was mostly kept alive because of their rivalry with the SEC. The more surprising thing was how most of this started because teams fleeing from Texas in the Big 12 and now Texas is in the SEC but the Big XII probably became a better conference without them.

 

[JDCrimson]

This is the demise of the NCAA in slow painful motion. The SEC and Big 10 will establish a new amateur model for both men and women's sports. It will likely culminate in AFL v NFL championship for awhile then a consolidation later with a new commissioner structure.

The leftover teams will still compete in the NCAA. NIL will still be allowed but for those teams there wont be much economic value in the NIL offered. So it wont matter.

i think the NCAA screwed up so badly with half butt plans like the BCS and the reaction to the Obannon case that it effectively killed the regionality of college football. After the Obannon case the jump to super conferences was probably the best path forward but ofcourse everyone sat on their hands and blindly trusted the ncaa.

Now it’s basically everyone trying to either escape to the SEC or B1G in order to stay fed. Mizzou, Vandy, Rutgers, and Maryland might be the biggest winners of the whole thing because now the big dogs are starting to sweat the future.

 

[KrAzY3]

I’m curious. Are folks here happy about the possible collapse of the ACC and PAC…or just commenting on which teams are most attractive to Big and SEC?
I still like having these different Power conferences in the sport. No interest in two giant conferences with no connection in terms of region or culture.

You gotta play the game by the rules as they are set forth.

Doesn't that stupid playoff have an automatic bid from each power conference? If so, death to the power conferences!

I'd like to turn back the clock to before NIL and before the playoff personally, two things I was never in favor of. But, I can't so...

Also, not directed at you but for those that haven't followed things closely, FSU is complaining about a problem that dated back years and there's been bad blood of sorts about (no surprise that UNC complained about their remarks considering they were on the other side of the issue).

When the ACC signed a big media rights deal, they included rights for football that they did not include for basketball. This obviously heavily favored their basketball programs. Basically they were saying football has to share everything, but basketball doesn't. This hit FSU particularly hard since they were spending like Bowden was around, but no longer had the success of the Bowden era and had financial shortfalls.

So, basically this ACC breakup has been looming since then, as they FSU went so far as to flirt with the Big 12, it also shows though that a pairing with the SEC or Big 10 wasn't necessarily a thing both sides wanted or it already would have happened.

 

[Crimson1967]

I just comment on what I think is best of the option I think are available.

If it were up to me the SEC would still have 10 teams.

If it makes you feel better, the Pac 8 is back. At least for today.

 

[Tidelines]

I don’t like all these changes, but I will digest them, adjust to them, and continue to watch the game I have loved all my life. Putting up with the greed and monopoly building structuring ( two super conferences ) are just the price of admission.

 

[KrAzY3]

For the record it sounds like the Pac-12 held a meeting to try to get schools did sign a grant of rights.

That apparently did not happen, and if anything could accelerate the departure of schools. Arizona appears headed to the Big 12, Oregon and Washington are talking to the Big 10 and it would seem Utah and Arizona State are strong considerations for the Big 12.

There's also longshot ACC talk of some sort of a merger or what have you, but if they weren't interested in just cherry picking the Pac-12, I 'm not sure how a merger would be more attractive or look better on paper.

 

[TideEngineer08]

For the record it sounds like the Pac-12 held a meeting to try to get schools did sign a grant of rights.

That apparently did not happen, and if anything could accelerate the departure of schools. Arizona appears headed to the Big 12, Oregon and Washington are talking to the Big 10 and it would seem Utah and Arizona State are strong considerations for the Big 12.

There's also longshot ACC talk of some sort of a merger or what have you, but if they weren't interested in just cherry picking the Pac-12, I 'm not sure how a merger would be more attractive or look better on paper.

If Arizona is gone to the Big 12, so is Arizona State.

Utah is obviously going to balk a bit at the Big 12 because they see it as crawling back to BYU. Which is funny, and ironic, but ultimately when they see the alternative is crawling back to the Mountain West Conference, they will gladly accept the Big 12 invite.

If the Big Ten is interested at all in Oregon and Washington, they're out.

That leaves Stanford, Cal, Washington State, and Oregon State. I could see the Big Ten also taking in Stanford, especially if it helps pull Notre Dame.

Yeah. The Pac 12 is dead.

 

[DzynKingRTR]

If Arizona is gone to the Big 12, so is Arizona State.

Utah is obviously going to balk a bit at the Big 12 because they see it as crawling back to BYU. Which is funny, and ironic, but ultimately when they see the alternative is crawling back to the Mountain West Conference, they will gladly accept the Big 12 invite.

If the Big Ten is interested at all in Oregon and Washington, they're out.

That leaves Stanford, Cal, Washington State, and Oregon State. I could see the Big Ten also taking in Stanford, especially if it helps pull Notre Dame.

Yeah. The Pac 12 is dead.

lots of folks will be looking for a new job. PAC12 commish and everyone that works there

 

[davefrat]

VT is a much better football draw than UVA...probably by a 2:1 or greater margin. VT fans are far more dedicated to football than UVA fans. Plus, UVA is much more closely aligned with the BIG than SEC in academic terms (whether that's a fair perception or not). As a native Virginian (who was also thrice-rejected by UVA) I can't see UVA ever joining the SEC, and certainly not unless UVA and VT come in as a package deal. UVA brings nothing to the table football-wise...on the field or in terms of viewership.

 

[KrAzY3]

UVA brings nothing to the table football-wise...on the field or in terms of viewership.

If UVA doesn't, neither does VT.

Just look at the ratings from 14-22 posted earlier. VT was at 1.92 million, Virginia was at 1.68. That's a negligible difference, especially if you consider Virginia is better at pretty much everything else (I think VT won the bass fishing championship).

The problem is the only thing VT is relatively good at is football, meaning they have nothing extra to offer the SEC. They'll get dominated in football, their attendance will continue to go down (it has been) and then what? They are just definitively worse, it's not like their athletic department can overall compete with Virginia. Virginia will still be Virginia in the SEC, VT will just be a worse version of what they are now, which already isn't that great.

Having said that, I do agree that Virginia probably prefers the Big 10, but make no mistake. If the Big 10 ends up with Notre Dame, North Carolina, Virginia and well whoever else, the SEC loses...