If you don't think playcalling matters, look at the "Jake Coker" year 2014/2015

[NWGATideFan]

I think people are romanticizing Kiffins time as OC while he was at UofA. I remember a whole lot of frustration with some of his play calling during his tenure. "Run Da Bawl" became a catch phrase, and how can we forget the very public butt chewing he received from Saban on the sidelines during the WKY game. To me, Kiffin thinks he's the smartest man in the room, and he's willing to prove it to his own detriment.

 

[AWRTR]

I think people are romanticizing Kiffins time as OC while he was at UofA. I remember a whole lot of frustration with some of his play calling during his tenure. "Run Da Bawl" became a catch phrase, and how can we forget the very public butt chewing he received from Saban on the sidelines during the WKY game. To me, Kiffin thinks he's the smartest man in the room, and he's willing to prove it to his own detriment.

Have to disagree with you. Kiffin worked with less dynamic offensive talent than Sark or BoB had. He beougjt in a new offensive philosophy and got an SEC title with a QB nobody wanted. I can’t imagine what he would have done with Tua and the four horsemen. He got the most out of what he had. Which was good taken t but no where near the qb talent since he left.

 

[SkullDuckery]

I think people are romanticizing Kiffins time as OC while he was at UofA. I remember a whole lot of frustration with some of his play calling during his tenure. "Run Da Bawl" became a catch phrase, and how can we forget the very public butt chewing he received from Saban on the sidelines during the WKY game. To me, Kiffin thinks he's the smartest man in the room, and he's willing to prove it to his own detriment.

I thought that came about with Daboll?

 

[NWGATideFan]

I thought that came about with Daboll?

Nope. Started with Kiffin.

From a Biloxi SunHerald article, dated 1/4/2017, by Jeff Clark, interviewing Jermaine "Funnymaine" Johnson:

"You can bet dollars to donuts that Johnson won’t be playing empty rooms wherever he performs these days. He is, after all, the man who coined the phrase all of us Bama fans were thinking (and screaming) — “run da bawl.” As in, “run the ball (former Alabama offensive coordinator Lane Kiffin)."

I would link the article, but it does contain a questionable word.

Some context: 2016 Hurts was the QB.
Hurts was a freshman, and was struggling in the passing game.
But Kiffin kept calling passing plays pretty regularly.

 

[bamamc1]

What Lane did with Blake Sims is unbelievable. He took a RB, DB, REC. and broke UA records. It may be the best coaching any of us will ever see.

 

[Goldrush]

My boys were watching some Bama highlights this weekend of the 2014/2015 season when Coker was the quarterback. I paused what I was doing and began watching. The playcalling Kiffin did once he figured out what he had as a team, was something to behold. Coker was nothing in the same stratosphere as B Young and what he did with that offense with Coker makes you realize how pathetic BOB was while he was here. I sat there for about 30 minutes and watched play after play of not only scheming wr's and TE's open but also making play calls to mitigate blitzing and defensive penetration. It made me realize that yes, ultimately players and their talent matter, but if you don't think playcalling carries its own weight of importance, go back several years pre BOB and watch, then re watch some games under BOB.

The 2014 team had the following:

Amari Cooper
OJ Howard
TJ Yelden
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

The 2015 team had the following:

Calvin Ridley
OJ Howard
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

Do people here realize how much stress is placed on the defense with Derrick Henry in the backfield? If last year's Bama team had Derrick Henry instead of Jahmyr Gibbs (who is pretty good, but not on Henry's level), Bama would have been undefeated in the regular season and probably wins the NC.

Kiffen did not have good offensive talent? I beg to differ. Those names above are carved in Crimson Tide lore.

 

[81usaf92]

I think people are romanticizing Kiffins time as OC while he was at UofA. I remember a whole lot of frustration with some of his play calling during his tenure. "Run Da Bawl" became a catch phrase, and how can we forget the very public butt chewing he received from Saban on the sidelines during the WKY game. To me, Kiffin thinks he's the smartest man in the room, and he's willing to prove it to his own detriment.

Eh. That’s an oversimplification of 3 years.

Run da ball happened mostly because there was a stretch where Coker was not doing well (somewhere after Georgia and before Auburn) yet we had Henry who couldn’t be stopped. A lot of fans started remembering the Ohio state (which many misremember as well) where it looked like we could’ve rode Henry to the championship.

But here is the thing…. In 14 we got to the Sugar Bowl because of Kiffin’s offense and in 2015 we beat Clemson because Kiffin’s play calling. Because Venerables totally sold out for Henry and mostly stopped him. It really wasn’t until Kiffin found their weakness that we started to destroy Clemson.

2016…. It’s a year in which Kiffin probably was here and there.

 

[AWRTR]

The 2014 team had the following:

Amari Cooper
OJ Howard
TJ Yelden
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

The 2015 team had the following:

Calvin Ridley
OJ Howard
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

Do people here realize how much stress is placed on the defense with Derrick Henry in the backfield? If last year's Bama team had Derrick Henry instead of Jahmyr Gibbs (who is pretty good, but not on Henry's level), Bama would have been undefeated in the regular season and probably wins the NC.

Kiffen did not have good offensive talent? I beg to differ. Those names above are carved in Crimson Tide lore.

You are missing one thing in that list, a QB. Kiffin had pretty average QB play. He used smoke and mirrors to with Hurts. He couldn't read the field in his freshman year, and most freshmen can't, and look where he is now. That is an intelligent dude with a great work ethic.

Kiffin didn't have a Tua, Mac, Bryce, or Oklahoma version of Hurts. He had some really good skill players, but only average QB play, and he still put up great numbers with scheme and taking advantage of match ups.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

The 2014 team had the following:

Amari Cooper
OJ Howard
TJ Yelden
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

The 2015 team had the following:

Calvin Ridley
OJ Howard
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

Do people here realize how much stress is placed on the defense with Derrick Henry in the backfield? If last year's Bama team had Derrick Henry instead of Jahmyr Gibbs (who is pretty good, but not on Henry's level), Bama would have been undefeated in the regular season and probably wins the NC.

Kiffen did not have good offensive talent? I beg to differ. Those names above are carved in Crimson Tide lore.

Who said Kiffin didn't have good offensive talent? What people are saying is Kiffin didn't have the luxury of having elite QB's ALONG WITH elite RB's AND Elite WR's yet ran a better offense than BOB. Do you really believe that not having an elite QB compared to having one is that negligible, especially seeing how the game has been played for close to 15 years now?

 

[JustNeedMe81]

The 2014 team had the following:

Amari Cooper
OJ Howard
TJ Yelden
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

The 2015 team had the following:

Calvin Ridley
OJ Howard
Kenyon Drake
Derrick Henry

Do people here realize how much stress is placed on the defense with Derrick Henry in the backfield? If last year's Bama team had Derrick Henry instead of Jahmyr Gibbs (who is pretty good, but not on Henry's level), Bama would have been undefeated in the regular season and probably wins the NC.

Kiffen did not have good offensive talent? I beg to differ. Those names above are carved in Crimson Tide lore.

1. No one is on Derrick Henry's level.. College or NFL.
2. I"m not so sure we win it all this past season. Defense cost us TN game. We did not adjust. LSU we were terrible on offense. We should've won that game easily.

 

[Goldrush]

Who said Kiffin didn't have good offensive talent? What people are saying is Kiffin didn't have the luxury of having elite QB's ALONG WITH elite RB's AND Elite WR's yet ran a better offense than BOB. Do you really believe that not having an elite QB compared to having one is that negligible, especially seeing how the game has been played for close to 15 years now?

Let's talk about facts.

BOB never had an elite RB in 2021 or 2022. BRob and Gibbs were certainly good, but not on that level. The only offensive player that was elite in 2022 was BY. Which means a lot of times, he had to win games by himself.

Contrast that with what Kiffin had in 2015. Coker was good, but everyone around him (Henry + Ridley + Howard) were top tier. Coker never had to win the game by himself. There were too many other threats the defense had to account for. This in turn made it easier for Coker to make plays. Bama had better offensive talent in 2015 than 2022.

Conclusion: You do not need an elite QB to win. A good QB can win if the other playmakers around him are top tier.

If Metchie/Williams had not gotten hurt in 2021, we would not even be having this conversation.

 

[Bamabuzzard]

Let's talk about facts.

BOB never had an elite RB in 2021 or 2022. BRob and Gibbs were certainly good, but not on that level. The only offensive player that was elite in 2022 was BY. Which means a lot of times, he had to win games by himself.

Contrast that with what Kiffin had in 2015. Coker was good, but everyone around him (Henry + Ridley + Howard) were top tier. Coker never had to win the game by himself. There were too many other threats the defense had to account for. This in turn made it easier for Coker to make plays. Bama had better offensive talent in 2015 than 2022.

Conclusion: You do not need an elite QB to win. A good QB can win if the other playmakers around him are top tier.

If Metchie/Williams had not gotten hurt in 2021, we would not even be having this conversation.

I couldn't find the "facts" in your post so I'll address the opinions.

Simply "good" players don't make NFL rosters and definitely do not start as RB's in the NFL. By the time BRob got his turn at RB he was definitely elite, just not in the same way Henry was. If "elite" was simply defined by being like Derrick Henry then there are literally thousands of RB's that have come through college football and gone on to play in the NFL that was "just good". Please don't tell me Gibbs wasn't elite, especially when ANNOUNCER after ANNOUNCER who called our games (Danielson being the main one, but there were definitely others) looked at Gibbs talent and said "he's special". That isn't said about "just good" players. How BOB used the kid made him ultimately look less than elite.

Regarding WR's, regarding football talent and athleticism, Ja'Cory Brooks IS ELITE, Kendrick Law (who I've personally watched play) IS ELITE, Isaiah Bond IS ELITE. Maybe the reason they didn't appear elite is because the standards within our program (specifically at practice) have slipped on top of the playcalling not being as "college level" as it should be.

And before you bring up Jamo Williams, 2/3's of his college coaching came from Ohio St, not Alabama. He transferred to Alabama because Ohio St's WR room was ridicously stacked with talent, but he still received the same coaching. Games aren't won on talent alone, coaching plays a huge role in developing talent and then in turn how that talent is used during games. Bad playcalling can make talent look untalented.