QB Competition 2018

[B1GTide]

Was it you or someone else that said in another thread that MSU's secondary wasn't very good? Their front 7, yes.
Apologies if it wasn't you.
I wasn't impressed by their secondary.
FWIW, I thought Jalen had one of his best games as a member of the Tide against LSU this year.

Before the MSU game I pointed out that they were statistically better than LSU and Auburn. I think that watching the games the difference was simple - LSU and Auburn both played press defense in the secondary, holding on almost every play. MSU did not. So MSU was softer in their secondary.

Stats don't show Jalen having a great game passing vs LSU. He was only 11/24 passing. But he made a number of clutch throws against them and MSU. He also made a few clutch throws against Auburn - but they were dropped.

 

[gtgilbert]

Show me his passing chart vs LSU, Auburn, and MSU (not a good defense) and throw in 2 more of the better SEC defenses we played . Hard to do with the SEC west having a down year. I'll go off that chart...

exactly this - a lot of the completions across the middle came later in games against not very good defenses. It's not been a question of if his arm is strong enough to get it there. It's a question of will/can he pull the trigger to make that throw when the window is tighter and the pressure is just a bit faster.

 

[TiderJack]

It is possible that he only has one read on certain plays, but there is no way that he only has one read on all plays. As you pointed out, we have evidence to the contrary.

I recall earlier in the year when the defense was in man and Jalen saw blitz coming he would look at his first read only and if covered he would take off since he knew the DB's would be running with our WR's and he had a chance at a big scramble running play. It was quick and decisive on Jalen's part which lead me to believe that was what he was told to do.

 

[BamaMoon]

I recall earlier in the year when the defense was in man and Jalen saw blitz coming he would look at his first read only and if covered he would take off since he knew the DB's would be running with our WR's and he had a chance at a big scramble running play. It was quick and decisive on Jalen's part which lead me to believe that was what he was told to do.

Isn't this when we have to audible to a hot route in a pre-snap read? I think I've seen him do this several times. That doesn't always mean it's a completion though.

On a blitz, unless the called play is a quick, first read throw, he'd have to audible for the play to have any chance of success....unless he just tried to scramble out of the blitz.

 

[CrimsonForce]

Is there a dedicated QB coach on that team or is that a shared duty by the offensive staff?

 

[B1GTide]

Isn't this when we have to audible to a hot route in a pre-snap read? I think I've seen him do this several times. That doesn't always mean it's a completion though.

On a blitz, unless the called play is a quick, first read throw, he'd have to audible for the play to have any chance of success....unless he just tried to scramble out of the blitz.

Depends on where the blitz is coming from and what route is called. In the NFL, if there is a corner blitz, the covered receiver has a specified "blitz" route to run to take advantage of the hole in the defense. The QB has to pick it up, as does the receiver. I am not sure if many college teams allow their QBs and receivers to make those kinds of adjustments at the LOS.

 

[B1GTide]

Is there a dedicated QB coach on that team or is that a shared duty by the offensive staff?

It is usually the OC - was Kiffin, should now be Daboll.

 

[CrimsonForce]

Depends on where the blitz is coming from and what route is called. In the NFL, if there is a corner blitz, the covered receiver has a specified "blitz" route to run to take advantage of the hole in the defense. The QB has to pick it up, as does the receiver. I am not sure if many college teams allow their QBs and receivers to make those kinds of adjustments at the LOS.

Yep, also referred to as a hot route. Also, some teams have WR run option routes which basically means the WR runs a route based on the coverage instead of pre-determined route. An example would be if the corner is playing off coverage the WR would run a quick hitch or slant but if the corner is playing press then the WR runs a go route. As you mentioned there has to be great chemistry and awareness between the WRs and QBs for hot routes and option routes to work..

 

[TiderJack]

Yep, also referred to as a hot route. Also, some teams have WR run option routes which basically means the WR runs a route based on the coverage instead of pre-determined route. An example would be if the corner is playing off coverage the WR would run a quick hitch or slant but if the corner is playing press then the WR runs a go route. As you mentioned their has to be great chemistry and awareness between the WRs and QBs for hot routes and option routes to work..

Good post. And the press/go route opens up the big play scramble if you can beat the blitz.

 

[gtgilbert]

Depends on where the blitz is coming from and what route is called. In the NFL, if there is a corner blitz, the covered receiver has a specified "blitz" route to run to take advantage of the hole in the defense. The QB has to pick it up, as does the receiver. I am not sure if many college teams allow their QBs and receivers to make those kinds of adjustments at the LOS.

I've seen Ridley signalling like crazy to Jalen that he read CB blitz, and Ridley going right to the spot left open by that blitz and making the cut expecting the ball only to look back and see Jalen took off running.

To the earlier question of being told to run if it's a blitz - could be, but then why was Ridley signalling? also, that works for a while, but then the defenses wise up and know he's going to try to run, so they send the CB blitz, but have the rest of the pressure soft rush, and the better defenses have an athlete capable of shadowing Jalen so it basically baits him into a play where he's not going to be successful.

 

[gman4tide]

Good post. And the press/go route opens up the big play scramble if you can beat the blitz.

Yes it does...however, when the wr beats the db off the line of scrimmage, if the qb understands/analyzes/reacts properly...he hits the wr (2 steps past the db) in stride and you have that play. IMO (and completely my opinion), this is what jalen either doesn't process fast enough or doesn't have the confidence to make. Many, many times we've had receivers breaking open only to have jalen either scrambling and throwing it away or plain tucking and running.

 

[Cauthonluck151]

I don't have a chart that helps, but MSU's defense is right up there with LSU's defense - better in most stats. And MSU is ranked higher than both in total defense (#10 in the country).

ETA - Statistically, MSU is better than both Auburn and LSU defensively.

http://myteamsbetter.com/#COMPARE_T...&statView=Defense&compareOption=ALL_OPPONENTS

http://myteamsbetter.com/#COMPARE_T...&statView=Defense&compareOption=ALL_OPPONENTS

MSU defenses greatest strength was their offensive ToP, we saw this on full display vs Bama. LSU and Auburn have the athletes to play us better than everyone else, but the SEC west was weak this year compared to years past. I believe a lot of the stats over the middle were against lesser competition.

Seprate point... Alabama QBs will always have way more talent around them at every position than any other team/QB... Tua is really the first QB we've had in Saban's tenor that has the tools and potential to actually go start in the pros right out of college (this is coming from a guy that loved AJ but never expected him to be a starter, and EDIT: for Tua it's almost all potential right now). Jalen is a great competitor/person but he will not play QB in the NFL. The talent discrepancy he has at Bama won't be there in the pros. I keep seeing people say Jalen led us to 25-2, I personally don't feel that's the case, (try defense and running game) not even close.

 

[JTBama]

I will point to the fact that there must be a lot of concern about Alabama's offense given the dozens of comments here and in sports media by people who cover the sport full time. It becomes a question of what is the issue than if there is one.

I studied the throwing motion and its mechanics for a number of years and will say that a large percentage of what makes any athlete reach the top of the pyramid is genetics and the mental acumen required to develop the motor skills involved.

I watched a number of professional athletes coming through middle and high school including Craig Kimbrel. At 16 yoa of so it was clear that Craig's arm was extraordinary among a group of pitchers who would go on to play college then professional ball.

It appears clear to many including professional QBs that Tua possesses that same exceptional level of "arm talent"

Of course I know that JH's father is a football coach. That doesn't mean that he necessarily knows much about throwing mechanics.

I have not suggested that JH cannot mature and improve his game with a lot of work. He is an exceptionally strong and fast athlete that can succeed very well in the right system. In my opinion however there is a small number of college QBs playing today that have a higher ceiling in terms of throwing the football, due principally to genetics, than JH does including Tua in that small group.

I think the key to understanding our offensive adjustments or adjustments that do or do not need to be made is first identifying our offensive identity. What kind of offense are we? There seemed to be at least to me through the season a lack of fluidity or identity in our offensive strategy as it varied game to game. While it can be said that those offensive strategies we're based on the opposition, in my opinion sometimes you can try to be good at everything without ever being great at anything. Now, I have no idea going forward if we are going to be an rpo style offense, more of a pro style offense or if we simply simplify what we have now . It's why I think it's so hard to know what adjustments we may see in the playoffs and beyond with any qb competition (which I think there will be) . I think we've incorporated alot when at times some simplicity was needed? I am a huge fan of more rb carries and less qb rushes . From this casual fans opinion, establishing an identity is the major factor in any adjustments made . For me?.....waiting to see the adjustments we do make is just as exciting as waiting for the playoff game itself. RTR

 

[TiderJack]

Yes it does...however, when the wr beats the db off the line of scrimmage, if the qb understands/analyzes/reacts properly...he hits the wr (2 steps past the db) in stride and you have that play. IMO (and completely my opinion), this is what jalen either doesn't process fast enough or doesn't have the confidence to make. Many, many times we've had receivers breaking open only to have jalen either scrambling and throwing it away or plain tucking and running.

I was commenting on the one read plays being discussed and not Jalen's decision making. Agreed that Jalen needs to have more patience/confidence on his reads.

 

[UAH]

MSU defenses greatest strength was their offensive ToP, we saw this on full display vs Bama. LSU and Auburn have the athletes to play us better than everyone else, but the SEC west was weak this year compared to years past. I believe a lot of the stats over the middle were against lesser competition.

Seprate point... Alabama QBs will always have way more talent around them at every position than any other team/QB... Tua is really the first QB we've had in Saban's tenor that has the tools and potential to actually go start in the pros right out of college (this is coming from a guy that loved AJ but never expected him to be a starter, and EDIT: for Tua it's almost all potential right now). Jalen is a great competitor/person but he will not play QB in the NFL. The talent discrepancy he has at Bama won't be there in the pros. I keep seeing people say Jalen led us to 25-2, I personally don't feel that's the case, (try defense and running game) not even close.

I believe that you are correct in your statement and conclusions.

 

[BamaMoon]

Thought I'd add this from another thread posted by TD7:

Remember some of the comments made by Ben Boulware after the game was pretty astonishing how vanilla they played on defense to force Jalen to beat them.I think that's the gameplan they will use again. Here are some his comments. According to Tigers standout linebacker Ben Boulware, Clemson "knew if we shut down the running game, then it would be very difficult for them to win. Boulware said, "wanted to put it in Jalen Hurts' hands."It was probably the most simple game plan we've had all year" http://www.al.com/alabamafootball/index.ssf/2017/01/clemson_linebacker_we_wanted_t.html

 

[crimsonaudio]

Thought I'd add this from another thread posted by TD7:

Yet Bama rushed 34 times for 221 yards (6.5 ypc avg). They didn't stop the running game, but they were right about the passing game (at that time).

Try that again this year and Bama wins.

 

[BamaMoon]

Yet Bama rushed 34 times for 221 yards (6.5 ypc avg). They didn't stop the running game, but they were right about the passing game (at that time).

Try that again this year and Bama wins.

It's hard to explain why we did what we did after Bo got injured. I know many say that was the turning point, but the running was working and it seems we abandoned it at that moment.

 

[JustNeedMe81]

Phil Savage from Senior Bowl said on the opening drive show this morning that He expected Alabama to show some things to Clemson that they haven't shown all year.

I definitely believe that because the offense has continue to evolve throughout the season, we've saw some new stuff in last few games. I would expect us to run lot of new stuff against Clemson and in championship game if we win.

 

[crimsonaudio]

I definitely believe that because the offense has continue to evolve throughout the season, we've saw some new stuff in last few games. I would expect us to run lot of new stuff against Clemson and in championship game when we win.

FIFY