Shula's Coaching Ability

[toliver2]

Look at the situation the team is in, and you will see Shula is indeed a effective coach.
Thanks to FRAUD for our wonderful Senior offensive line this year.

Go back and look at the roster from last year, or two or three years ago and you will see that we have lost several players that should have been seniors or juniors this year. If they were good enough to they would still be here.

I think Shula coached this team into overachieving this year, we have a severe lack of depth and talent, and has this team really had a chance to develop into what is should be.

Brodie is a good qb but how good could he have been. He came here and learned FRAUD's offense (which sucked), then he started trying to learn Price's offense, then Shula comes in and implements his offense in what? 2 weeks of practice. Brodie played hurt his first year under Shula and couldn't even begin to develop how he should have. We saw what happened to him last year. So now in his first real chance to showcase his ability and he is unable to be 100% effective because his offensive line has no experience. So once again, I say place blame where blame is due. FRAUD pulled the wool over our eyes, he said all the right things and did what the bama nation wanted, he won quick.But would you rather have that semi-wonderful season from his last year, or would you have rather us be in a position this year to really have so outstanding talent?
I know my answer, but of course hindsight is 20/20.

 

[wisten]

You make some great points. Regardless of the fact that we came into this season expecting 6-6 (that was my call way back when right here on this board), we are sitting at 9-2, and with the exception of ONE QUARTER this ENTIRE season, we have come out blazing, a few times on BOTH sides of the ball.

 

[alatider]

I'm just glad that the season is over......

 

[teamplayer]

Shula and the staff are doing a good job of putting our program on stable ground. We really haven't had that in a while. I am hoping to finish with a win in the bowl game, have a good recruiting class, and have a strong spring practice. It looks like we will be counting on a lot of youngsters next year, so I hope the staff can coach 'em up and make us competitive. Roll Tide.

 

[trenda]

You make some great points. Regardless of the fact that we came into this season expecting 6-6 (that was my call way back when right here on this board), we are sitting at 9-2, and with the exception of ONE QUARTER this ENTIRE season, we have come out blazing, a few times on BOTH sides of the ball.

That's it in a nutshell! Excellent way of putting it.

Sure, there are problems that need to be dealt with. Some can be handled immediately. Some are just going to take some time.

But . . . at the end of the day, look where our team is. Preseason predictions had us at best a darkhorse candidate for the SECW - which is exactly what played out. In fact, we ended flirting as a darkhorse for the national championship! The Tide beat the teams they were supposed to beat and even a couple they weren't supposed to. You couldn't really ask more of this team.

We've got a long ways to go before this program is where Coach Shula and everyone else wants it to be; but, man, did we make some strides this year!

 

[Redwood Forrest]

I'd bet $20 that the same people who were calling for Coach Kines head are the same ones calling for the OC and OL coaches heads. But then, they got their football degrees at Wal-Mart, didn't they.

And by the way, next year they will be back to calling for Joe's head again. Just wait and see.

 

[bamapeppy]

Look at the situation the team is in, and you will see Shula is indeed a effective coach.
Thanks to FRAUD for our wonderful Senior offensive line this year.

Go back and look at the roster from last year, or two or three years ago and you will see that we have lost several players that should have been seniors or juniors this year. If they were good enough to they would still be here.

I think Shula coached this team into overachieving this year, we have a severe lack of depth and talent, and has this team really had a chance to develop into what is should be.

Brodie is a good qb but how good could he have been. He came here and learned FRAUD's offense (which sucked), then he started trying to learn Price's offense, then Shula comes in and implements his offense in what? 2 weeks of practice. Brodie played hurt his first year under Shula and couldn't even begin to develop how he should have. We saw what happened to him last year. So now in his first real chance to showcase his ability and he is unable to be 100% effective because his offensive line has no experience. So once again, I say place blame where blame is due. FRAUD pulled the wool over our eyes, he said all the right things and did what the bama nation wanted, he won quick.But would you rather have that semi-wonderful season from his last year, or would you have rather us be in a position this year to really have so outstanding talent?
I know my answer, but of course hindsight is 20/20.

We signed 4 linemen in 3 years if my memory is up to snuff. That is frans 2 years and either the year befor him or after him. DuBose had some that didnt quyalify and never played.

 

[Alanbama27]

I'd bet $20 that the same people who were calling for Coach Kines head are the same ones calling for the OC and OL coaches heads. But then, they got their football degrees at Wal-Mart, didn't they.

And by the way, next year they will be back to calling for Joe's head again. Just wait and see.

Thank God for somebody with a brain! Great post!

 

[kcin_4_BAMA]

I'd bet $20 that the same people who were calling for Coach Kines head are the same ones calling for the OC and OL coaches heads. But then, they got their football degrees at Wal-Mart, didn't they.

And by the way, next year they will be back to calling for Joe's head again. Just wait and see.

I'll take that bet.
I have had issues w/ Rader since his arrival, but I also understood the need for continuity in the program. Now that we have shown marked improvement & the ability to win, CMS needs to find that OC out there who will turn this AWFUL offensive situation around. That could be DR, but we'll never know until he has full control. I'm not necessarily calling for his dismissal like I was in previous years, because I saw a spark early, but changes need to be made. CMS has 400 million things going on each & every day & play calling should not be one of them. I think he will make a change after the bowl.
As for the OL, that's just terrible. I know there is a lack of talent(to some degree) but lack of adjustments is based in LARGE PART on coaching. Connelly is not adjusting, PERIOD. That's where CMS comes in. If he's always worried about play calling, he can't do his job, which is to prepare his coaches to help prepare his team.
There has to be some roles defined & soon.

 

[toliver2]

Here is part of a post I made on another thread.
I don't think any changes need to be made to the coaching staff. Regardless of the who is calling the plays, How many coaches design or call plays with the intention of the play not working?
If a guard missed his assignment, is that the coaches fault? Maybe if the coach isn't teaching them anything. Radar and Kines have been around for a long time. They aren't stupid. Here's a good analogy, would you rather take a cross country trip in First class state of the art motor home, or a beat up pinto with 3 flat tires. I don't care if Jeff Gordon or Dale Earnhardt are driving, you aint going to make it in the pinto. Unfortunately the pinto would be an improvement, b/c I think we are trying to do in on a bicycle w/o a chain. Give 'em time and soon we will be cruisin in luxury. You have to have the tools to be successful. The coaches aren't the tools, the players are.

 

[bamaslammer]

Major college football is all about the Program, its everything from game planning to recruiting to high school football camps, to the assistants. I firmly believe Shula is well on his way to becomeing a SOLID SEC contending coach, but that building process will take a few more years. and some tweaking will need to be done here and there, especially with the staff or their assignments.

As awful as it is to do, all you have to do is watch how Tubberville has.... I'll say improved since he clearly has not "Matured". He was a trainwreck himself for years but finally he got the right assistants and a large stockpile of quality players and things look good for him now. But 2 or 3 years back the Auburn folks were convinced he was an idiot and had to go. I still think he's an idiot, but he has surrounded himself with some pretty smart people. And Having his competition on probation has been a nice little help too.

Also I might note that Auburn has not had a significant injury in 2 years. That kind of luck doesn't last forever. One day things will turn our way, and assuming we don't get put back on probation, these 3 and 4 year streaks will not happen.

 

[TidenLA]

I'd bet $20 that the same people who were calling for Coach Kines head are the same ones calling for the OC and OL coaches heads. But then, they got their football degrees at Wal-Mart, didn't they.

And by the way, next year they will be back to calling for Joe's head again. Just wait and see.

Ok Redwood..you tell us what is so BRILLIANT about the OL's Coaching? I know they are young and without the starting center, but come on...that display was the worst I have seen in 30 years....bar none!!!!

 

[RamaJamaDog]

I agree with Redwood

I'd bet $20 that the same people who were calling for Coach Kines head are the same ones calling for the OC and OL coaches heads. But then, they got their football degrees at Wal-Mart, didn't they.

And by the way, next year they will be back to calling for Joe's head again. Just wait and see.

Yes, and there as ignorant about the game as they can be! Let's ignore them.

 

[CrimsonDuck]

Here is part of a post I made on another thread.
I don't think any changes need to be made to the coaching staff. Regardless of the who is calling the plays, How many coaches design or call plays with the intention of the play not working?
If a guard missed his assignment, is that the coaches fault? Maybe if the coach isn't teaching them anything. Radar and Kines have been around for a long time. They aren't stupid. Here's a good analogy, would you rather take a cross country trip in First class state of the art motor home, or a beat up pinto with 3 flat tires. I don't care if Jeff Gordon or Dale Earnhardt are driving, you aint going to make it in the pinto. Unfortunately the pinto would be an improvement, b/c I think we are trying to do in on a bicycle w/o a chain. Give 'em time and soon we will be cruisin in luxury. You have to have the tools to be successful. The coaches aren't the tools, the players are.

Some coaches are better than others.

There are countless examples of this, but let's look at a random example from the 2000 era of college football.

Maryland.

Well, Maryland had little to no offensive success from 1990-2000, the decade prior to Ralph Friedgen's arrival.

1990: 19.75
1991: 12.54
1992: 26.54
1993: 22.10
1994: 24.54
1995: 19.10
1996: 17.0
1997: 14.64
1998: 18.4
1999: 26.5
2000: 22.5

Okay, needless to say, those are not pretty numbers. That is a decade of SUCK offensively.

But in comes Ralph Friedgen, this rather hefty individual from Georgia Tech, a place where Friedgen coached offenses that averaged:

1997: 26.1
1998: 35.5
1999: 38.4
2000: 32.2

Friedgen was noted for his imaginitive, tricky playcalling with a knack for calling the right play in the right situation.

Well, Friedgen would be the playcaller for a Maryland team who's best success over the previous ten years equalled Friedgen's worst success in his four years at Ga. Tech. Would he be able to actually make an offense that had a no-name QB, no-name WRs, and an unproven RB work?

Well, in the three years prior to Friedgen's arrival at Maryland the Terps broke pretty much all of their offensive scoring and yardage records, averaging 433 yards per game and 34 pts. per game in 2001, 391 yards per game and 32.2 points per game in 2002, and 391 yards per game and 31.2 points per game in 2003.

What happened here? Did Friedgen all of a sudden inherit this imensely talented Terps squad that The Fridge inhereted at JUST the right time? I think not.

The yardage similarities between his offenses at Ga. Tech and MD are frighteningly similar. In his final three years at Ga Tech the Yellow Jackets avg.'d

Rushing: 189.6 yards per game
Passing: 250.3 yards per game
Points: 35.4 points per game

First three years at Maryland

Rushing: 200.3 yards per game
Passing: 214.3 yards per game
Points: 32.6 points per game

Does anyone know the names of ANY of Friedgen's players at MD from 2001-2003? Any running backs? Any wide recievers? Any QB's? VERY few of Friedgen's offensive players ended up in the NFL. These were not extremely talented players, but Friedgen was capable of taking players that were not THAT talented, implementing them into a system that had previous success, and voila! 200 yards a game rushing, 200 yards a game passing, at both Ga. Tech and MD.

Alabama's current offense has had no previous success on any level. It has not been effective in the NFL, and it has been average to bad in college. There are seven years worth of statistical evidence to prove that this offense is not an offense that will score points on a consistent basis.

So why continue running it? It's not as though somone is getting fired in this situation, unless someone decides that is what needs to be done. I mean, CMS is our playcaller! He controls the offense and the plays that are called in this offense! All that would need to be done is a hire. No firing. Just hiring.

Why not hire someone that has had proven success elsewhere with players that are not extremely talented.

The ability of a coach is most apparent in situations where the players that they are working with are not excellent, talented players. This is a situation that this offense has been in for three years now, and it has proven to be an offense that cannot succeed unless every facet of the offense is healthy and talented. Coaches have succeeded in these situations before. And it would be a wise move on Bama's part to hire a guy that has a proven track-record of having success without having the most talented players.

 

[Jaco]

You make some great points. Regardless of the fact that we came into this season expecting 6-6 (that was my call way back when right here on this board), we are sitting at 9-2, and with the exception of ONE QUARTER this ENTIRE season, we have come out blazing, a few times on BOTH sides of the ball.

wisten, are you on crack? we have looked bad in several quarters of several games all year, with the exception of the Florida game. But we did enough to win 9 games. We overachieved to get where we were. And Auburn has a great team, and deserved to win that game.

 

[wisten]

wisten, are you on crack? we have looked bad in several quarters of several games all year, with the exception of the Florida game. But we did enough to win 9 games. We overachieved to get where we were. And Auburn has a great team, and deserved to win that game.

Read it again. Blazing. EVERY GAME. Sometimes on offense. A bit clearer now?

 

[ihatefulmer]

wisten, are you on crack? we have looked bad in several quarters of several games all year, with the exception of the Florida game. But we did enough to win 9 games. We overachieved to get where we were. And Auburn has a great team, and deserved to win that game.

We just hit on our big plays in the UF game. If you go back and look we had 1 drive for a TD. The 3 other td's we had came on the long throw to Prothro, Brown took the quick slant for a big play and our D got a turnover deep in UF's end that we scored on. The UF pass rush hassled Brodie the whole game. IMO, the USC game was our best game. The line, by far, was theit best game. Our O was gone when Brodie lost his touch on the dep balls. IMO, there was 2 reasons for this. 1. was when Pro got hurt. 2. Brodie started wearing that knee brace about the same time. I feel this might have been a factor in the loss of his touch.

 

[ihatefulmer]

Some coaches are better than others.

There are countless examples of this, but let's look at a random example from the 2000 era of college football.

Maryland.

Well, Maryland had little to no offensive success from 1990-2000, the decade prior to Ralph Friedgen's arrival.

1990: 19.75
1991: 12.54
1992: 26.54
1993: 22.10
1994: 24.54
1995: 19.10
1996: 17.0
1997: 14.64
1998: 18.4
1999: 26.5
2000: 22.5

Okay, needless to say, those are not pretty numbers. That is a decade of SUCK offensively.

But in comes Ralph Friedgen, this rather hefty individual from Georgia Tech, a place where Friedgen coached offenses that averaged:

1997: 26.1
1998: 35.5
1999: 38.4
2000: 32.2

Friedgen was noted for his imaginitive, tricky playcalling with a knack for calling the right play in the right situation.

Well, Friedgen would be the playcaller for a Maryland team who's best success over the previous ten years equalled Friedgen's worst success in his four years at Ga. Tech. Would he be able to actually make an offense that had a no-name QB, no-name WRs, and an unproven RB work?

Well, in the three years prior to Friedgen's arrival at Maryland the Terps broke pretty much all of their offensive scoring and yardage records, averaging 433 yards per game and 34 pts. per game in 2001, 391 yards per game and 32.2 points per game in 2002, and 391 yards per game and 31.2 points per game in 2003.

What happened here? Did Friedgen all of a sudden inherit this imensely talented Terps squad that The Fridge inhereted at JUST the right time? I think not.

The yardage similarities between his offenses at Ga. Tech and MD are frighteningly similar. In his final three years at Ga Tech the Yellow Jackets avg.'d

Rushing: 189.6 yards per game
Passing: 250.3 yards per game
Points: 35.4 points per game

First three years at Maryland

Rushing: 200.3 yards per game
Passing: 214.3 yards per game
Points: 32.6 points per game

Does anyone know the names of ANY of Friedgen's players at MD from 2001-2003? Any running backs? Any wide recievers? Any QB's? VERY few of Friedgen's offensive players ended up in the NFL. These were not extremely talented players, but Friedgen was capable of taking players that were not THAT talented, implementing them into a system that had previous success, and voila! 200 yards a game rushing, 200 yards a game passing, at both Ga. Tech and MD.

Alabama's current offense has had no previous success on any level. It has not been effective in the NFL, and it has been average to bad in college. There are seven years worth of statistical evidence to prove that this offense is not an offense that will score points on a consistent basis.

So why continue running it? It's not as though somone is getting fired in this situation, unless someone decides that is what needs to be done. I mean, CMS is our playcaller! He controls the offense and the plays that are called in this offense! All that would need to be done is a hire. No firing. Just hiring.

Why not hire someone that has had proven success elsewhere with players that are not extremely talented.

The ability of a coach is most apparent in situations where the players that they are working with are not excellent, talented players. This is a situation that this offense has been in for three years now, and it has proven to be an offense that cannot succeed unless every facet of the offense is healthy and talented. Coaches have succeeded in these situations before. And it would be a wise move on Bama's part to hire a guy that has a proven track-record of having success without having the most talented players.

Alabama's current offense has had no previous success on any level. It has not been effective in the NFL, and it has been average to bad in college. There are seven years worth of statistical evidence to prove that this offense is not an offense that will score points on a consistent basis.

My friend your just wrong. Shula's type of O is what The U. of Miami has been running since Jimmy Johnson was there. It worked 20 years ago and its still working at the U today. It's the same thing JJ did when he was with Cowboys. Neither have or had a thick playbook with a lot of plays that they use to trick the D. These teams run right at you. They dont run options or a lot of pulling linemen they just run run right at you. They dont use alot of formations with 4 and 5 wr. The reason these teams have had success with this type of O is EXECUTION. To get the type of execution that is needed to win championships you got to have TALENT. Jimmy Johnson wasn't a great coach because of play calling he was a great at finding talent. IMO, the reason Shula's O struggled agasint the good teams in 05 is that we are still short on talent on the O-line. I promise you when Shula get's the talent he needs and he's getting closer he will start putting more hardware in that trophy case in Bryant Museum.

 

[CrimsonDuck]

My friend your just wrong. Shula's type of O is what The U. of Miami has been running since Jimmy Johnson was there. It worked 20 years ago and its still working at the U today. It's the same thing JJ did when he was with Cowboys. Neither have or had a thick playbook with a lot of plays that they use to trick the D. These teams run right at you. They dont run options or a lot of pulling linemen they just run run right at you. They dont use alot of formations with 4 and 5 wr. The reason these teams have had success with this type of O is EXECUTION. To get the type of execution that is needed to win championships you got to have TALENT. Jimmy Johnson wasn't a great coach because of play calling he was a great at finding talent. IMO, the reason Shula's O struggled agasint the good teams in 05 is that we are still short on talent on the O-line. I promise you when Shula get's the talent he needs and he's getting closer he will start putting more hardware in that trophy case in Bryant Museum.

It is an offense similar to the offense that Miami runs. However, just because certain formations look alike and certain plays look alike, it doesn't mean the offenses are anywhere near the same.

Numerous other teams run the same style of offense in the NFL, but even when Shula was calling these same plays in the NFL they were not working.

The most successful offensive coordinators have the ability to call the right play at the right time. They have incredible offensive timing.

If you are actually interested in understanding the difference in Miami and Alabama offensively, just tape a game of each. It's not that hard.

Break down the plays, play by play, if you have the time to do so, and you will see that these are two completely different offenses.

Mike Shula has had seven years of legitimate playcalling experience to put on display what he is capable of as a PLAY CALLER. He has not been successful.

It just makes sense for Shula to give up play calling duties and bring in an experienced guy that has had previous success.

 

[Crimson-Blitz]

"Mike Shula has had seven years of legitimate playcalling experience to put on display what he is capable of as a PLAY CALLER. He has not been successful."

Some people would say that a 9-2 regular season record is pretty damn successful.