Attack on recruiting stations in Chattanooga

Tide1986

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If he doesn't say "workplace violence" then he's not being consistent. It did happen in the military's workplace. So, it has to be workplace violence if that person is going to be consistent in his faulty thinking.

I just wish they had been armed so they could carry out the trash and not have to depend on others to rid this society of that individual.

The question I want answered is: "Is he with some of his 72 vestal virgins in Paradise yet?" Wait, I really don't want to know someone else's answer to that because I already know the answer. I THINK I know what Christ would say, "Forgive him because he did not know what he was doing."

I send up a prayer to Almighty God in the name of Christ for these Marines who were murdered and their families and for those who were injured.
Was the shooter also in the military? If so, I agree the incident should be labeled "workplace violence" for consistency's sake.

But between you and me and the fence post, this is likely radical Islamic terrorism.
 

Al A Bama

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Was the shooter also in the military? If so, I agree the incident should be labeled "workplace violence" for consistency's sake.

But between you and me and the fence post, this is likely radical Islamic terrorism.
Then, will He call it what it is? Or are we going to have to redefine "is" again?
 

rolltide_21

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Was the shooter also in the military? If so, I agree the incident should be labeled "workplace violence" for consistency's sake.

But between you and me and the fence post, this is likely radical Islamic terrorism.
I agree. Domestic terrorism describes it perfectly. He was a local resident (Kuwait-born) who grown up in Chattanooga and attended UTC. Currently the FBI is investigating a recent trip to Jordan he made. There is no evidence, so far, that he had contacts with radicals but that could change as the investigation continues.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/chattan...-jordan-scrutinized-by-authorities-1437140737

I will continue to pray for the families of the 4 marines. I am thankful the police officer was not seriously injured.

EDIT- The WSJ article is to a premium site. Here's a summary of the article: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/1...ties-scrutinize-chattanooga-shooter-visit-to/

Another article about the investigation: http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/17/us-usa-shooting-tennessee-idUSKCN0PQ1WY20150717
 
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Crimson1967

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Everyone was quick to call the last shooter a racist. Why tippy toe around calling this guy an Islamic terrorist?


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Displaced Bama Fan

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Everyone was quick to call the last shooter a racist. Why tippy toe around calling this guy an Islamic terrorist?


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Because it's offensive. I'm sure our liberal leaning brethren would prefer to call him misunderstood and oppressed by our "white privileged" citizens.
 

rolltide_21

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Everyone was quick to call the last shooter a racist. Why tippy toe around calling this guy an Islamic terrorist?


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I agree. To me the obvious reason, it does not fit the mainstream media's narrative.
 
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Bazza

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Well, Clinton started it and neither Bush nor Obama have changed it - meanwhile, we have some of the most well-trained firearms users on the planet remaining unarmed and targeted due to stupidity.
I agree.

Base commanders should have latitude to arm their personnel as deemed necessary.

Hopefully there will be some changes to this policy coming soon.
 

2003TIDE

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Base commanders should have latitude to arm their personnel as deemed necessary.
I agree with what you are saying, but this place is maybe a little more than a national guard center. Whenever we go to Chattanooga, we jog past this place on the river walk. There is zero perimeter security which that is prob the issue. I think an armed guard at the entrance would go a long way at smaller reserve centers like this. Below is the street view of the entrance. Most of the time you see the military guys out jogging too of course they don't have guns then, but they are outside the fence at that point.

Google Street View
 

Tidewater

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I agree with what you are saying, but this place is maybe a little more than a national guard center. Whenever we go to Chattanooga, we jog past this place on the river walk. There is zero perimeter security which that is prob the issue. I think an armed guard at the entrance would go a long way at smaller reserve centers like this. Below is the street view of the entrance. Most of the time you see the military guys out jogging too of course they don't have guns then, but they are outside the fence at that point.

Google Street View
Recruiting center and a reserve center. a barrier around a recruiting center might be counterproductive.
The NOSC had a fence around it, and swerve barriers at the entrances, but not 24/7 armed guards. Such centers are manned intermittently. Sometimes, esp. summer, you will have lots of guys there. Other times, you will have a handful.
 

81usaf92

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I'd say more on O'Bummer's hands. His timidity with our edcalating ISIS problems have led to these terrorists becoming more and more aggressive even within OUR OWN BORDERS.

Did y'all notice that he didn't mention the scumbag's name? :mad::mad::mad:
Terrorism cant be killed becuase hatred cant either. We have had many events under clinton. Clinton had the WTC andbUSS Cole bombings along with the OKC bombing and columbine. The USS Cole bombing was the only one not stateside. W had the WTC, the Antrax scare, a few dirty bombers, the NYC recruiting station, and the DC snipers. All of them were stateside. Radical islam and spree shooters are just the new thing.

I am by no means an Obama fan, but really what more can you do about ISIS that hasnt been done? If you look at ISIS's overall goal you would see that they want to provoke a western power to invade Syria. The biggest problem with that is that the Quaran outlines that the end of days for Islam will occur when a western power invades a certain city in Syria, and all of the Muslims will rise up and take back the world. ISIS is mainly hiding in Syria and is banking on us being dumb enough to send foot soldiers in to find them. So periodically taken out small groups is probably the best strategy for this enemy.

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2015/02/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

The Islamic State awaits the army of “Rome,” whose defeat at Dabiq, Syria, will initiate the countdown to the apocalypse.
I guess the only thing that can be done is to arm all military personnel, but they are still going to commit terrorist acts just like alqueda, but unlike Alqueda they are hiding in an extremely important religous area for the Islamic people.
 
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Tidewater

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Recruiting center had bulletproof glass. I think that is about all you can do there. No loss of life was at the recruiting center.
Probably right.
Illustrative stat, by the way. If you cannot afford 24/7 guards (and they ain't cheap), then someone ought to be armed inside the place. I don't know, since it is a military installation, where could they possibly find someone trained on how to use firearms? (That sarcasm was not aimed at you, BTW)

Many do not realize that Staff Duty Officers in Army units in Germany in the 1970s had to go around the unit area armed with a loaded .45, because it was so dangerous. Duty officers were being attacked and killed by scumbags the US Army had recruited in the lean years of the 1970s. The new Duty Officer comes on shift, the outgoing fellow pops the mag, counts the rounds, signs the pistol and rounds over to the next fellow. Simple.
How many soldiers have to be gunned down on military installations before we adopt appropriate policies to protect them?
 

TIDE-HSV

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Probably right.
Illustrative stat, by the way. If you cannot afford 24/7 guards (and they ain't cheap), then someone ought to be armed inside the place. I don't know, since it is a military installation, where could they possibly find someone trained on how to use firearms? (That sarcasm was not aimed at you, BTW)

Many do not realize that Staff Duty Officers in Army units in Germany in the 1970s had to go around the unit area armed with a loaded .45, because it was so dangerous. Duty officers were being attacked and killed by scumbags the US Army had recruited in the lean years of the 1970s. The new Duty Officer comes on shift, the outgoing fellow pops the mag, counts the rounds, signs the pistol and rounds over to the next fellow. Simple.
How many soldiers have to be gunned down on military installations before we adopt appropriate policies to protect them?
It seems as if we never learn...
 

Tidewater

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It seems as if we never learn...
Back in 1993, the antecedents of al Qaeda bombed the US Barracks in Khobar Towers, Saudi Arabia, the USAF General in command was relieved and the Clinton Administration, in effect, told every military commander, "If you have a single casualty, and you have not done everything possible ot protect them, you will be relieved." This unleashed a tornado of risk aversion across the senior leadership of DoD bordering on organizational cowardice. No risk was accepted unless absolutely unavoidable. Ever. No matter what the mission was, senior leadership became scared of their shadows and that attitude trickled down.

I believe I have related this, but it bears repeating. In the Sinai in 1996, I came across a group of paratroopers from the 82nd Airborne Division on a peacekeeping mission. I noticed that, while they were filling sandbags, their weapons were leaning against a nearby building, no magazines in the magazine wells. I asked the sergeant what gives and he told me that, not only did they not have ammo handy, but the battalion commander had ordered his NCOs to confiscate the bolts out of the weapons out of fear of one of the soldiers having negligent discharge. Now, this was in the Middle East, Loony Central, for Pete's sake. No bolts. If someone with a gun had attacked them, to would have been a bloodbath.

Things changed on September 11th.

Now, if the CinC will tell military leaders that the next time soldiers are gunned down on a military base and the commander has not done what he can, including, if necessary, arming (after training) some or all of his or her subordinates, then that commander will be relieved, the local commanders will respond.

I believe this CinC is too ideologically-committed to issue such an order, even if it will save soldiers' lives.
 

TIDE-HSV

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Back in 1993, the antecedents of al Qaeda bombed the US Barracks in Khobar Towers, Saudi Arabia, the USAF General in command was relieved and the Clinton Administration, in effect, told every military commander, "If you have a single casualty, and you have not done everything possible ot protect them, you will be relieved." This unleashed a tornado of risk aversion across the senior leadership of DoD bordering on organizational cowardice. No risk was accepted unless absolutely unavoidable. Ever. No matter what the mission was, senior leadership became scared of their shadows and that attitude trickled down.

I believe I have related this, but it bears repeating. In the Sinai in 1996, I came across a group of paratroopers from the 82nd Airborne Division on a peacekeeping mission. I noticed that, while they were filling sandbags, their weapons were leaning against a nearby building, no magazines in the magazine wells. I asked the sergeant what gives and he told me that, not only did they not have ammo handy, but the battalion commander had ordered his NCOs to confiscate the bolts out of the weapons out of fear of one of the soldiers having negligent discharge. Now, this was in the Middle East, Loony Central, for Pete's sake. No bolts. If someone with a gun had attacked them, to would have been a bloodbath.

Things changed on September 11th.

Now, if the CinC will tell military leaders that the next time soldiers are gunned down on a military base and the commander has not done what he can, including, if necessary, arming (after training) some or all of his or her subordinates, then that commander will be relieved, the local commanders will respond.

I believe this CinC is too ideologically-committed to issue such an order, even if it will save soldiers' lives.
Jeez! No soldier can reassemble a gun of that class quickly enough to protect himself. Like someone said way above, bullet proof glass is a damned good start. If the perp has to come inside and the soldiers are armed, then - different outcome...
 

2003TIDE

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I believe I have related this, but it bears repeating. In the Sinai in 1996, I came across a group of paratroopers from the 82nd Airborne Division on a peacekeeping mission. I noticed that, while they were filling sandbags, their weapons were leaning against a nearby building, no magazines in the magazine wells. I asked the sergeant what gives and he told me that, not only did they not have ammo handy, but the battalion commander had ordered his NCOs to confiscate the bolts out of the weapons out of fear of one of the soldiers having negligent discharge. Now, this was in the Middle East, Loony Central, for Pete's sake. No bolts. If someone with a gun had attacked them, to would have been a bloodbath.
I have a work buddy that is older than me. He was Marine Reserves. He joined after the end of the 1st Gulf War. Said the older guys told them that when they got over to Iraq they were handed a M-16, a clip, and 3 rounds. Thought he was half joking, but this seems in line with what you are saying.
 

2003TIDE

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BTW now they are saying this guy worked at a nuclear power plant at one point(I'm assuming one of the TVA's.) I always thought those background checks where pretty thorough. The FBI had no clue about this guy even after he apparently went to the Middle East several times. Makes you wonder....
 

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