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Gas going up?

The oil speculators need to be reigned in. No way should oil be fluctuating as much as it has over the past year. Some people say it was a supply & demand issue, but that is simply not the case, because demand was actually down when the gas prices were rising and eventually hit almost $150 per gallon. The problem is that we have too many large investors who have no real tangible interest in the oil business driving the prices up to make money. I'm all for free markets, but in this case there needs to be more regulation because our economy is so heavily tied to oil prices.
 
Bama323 said:
The oil speculators need to be reigned in. No way should oil be fluctuating as much as it has over the past year. Some people say it was a supply & demand issue, but that is simply not the case, because demand was actually down when the gas prices were rising and eventually hit almost $150 per gallon. The problem is that we have too many large investors who have no real tangible interest in the oil business driving the prices up to make money. I'm all for free markets, but in this case there needs to be more regulation because our economy is so heavily tied to oil prices.
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I might agree if you could offer specific ideas...
 
NYBamaFan said:
I might agree if you could offer specific ideas...
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I'm not an expert on oil markets and trading, but I believe that oil trading was deregulated to some degree in the late 90's or early 2000's to allow more speculation. Obviously, alot of these investors have no real tangible interest in the oil business, they simply speculate on oil as an investment or vehicle to make money. These large sums of money that are getting thrown into the oil markets seem to be causing increased volitility with oil prices, regardless of what supply and demand principals say should be happening. Alot of money was removed from the oil markets a couple of months ago when Congress started getting involved, and when these large investment firms starting having problems due to the busted real estate bubble. Obviously, the price of gasoline should not rise almost $100 a barrell within months, and then fall over $100 a barrell also within a short period of time. This just doesn't jive, because there is no way on earth that demand or supply have been effected enough to cause such an extreme shift in gasoline prices. Simply, it has to do with speculation. IMO, we need to regulate oil speculation so that only those with a vested interest in oil, i.e., oil companies, electric companies, etc. can trade on oil. That way, oil prices are truly driven by supply and demand, instead of being driven mainly by profiteering, which is hurting everyone except the large investment firms that keep using the oil markets to make money.

I saw this episode on 60 minutes recently that really opened my eyes up to what went on when oil went to almost $150 per barrell a few months ago. Watch this and see if you don't agree with what I am saying:

[ame="http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4713382n"]The Price Of Oil - 60 Minutes - CBS News[/ame]
 
I also hear Congress wants to push through a 50% gas tax, which has a very good chance of passing. That would not be good.
 
The reason gas is going back up is that we are riding up the reserves that we built up when it was $4/gallon. As we built the reserves and oil deflated the price dropped dramatically. OPEC cut production to help raise the price again but the existing surpluses prevented that. You can see the price of surplus gas on the stock exchange ,RBOB gasoline, got to below $1/gallon.

Now from that time the Arabs have slashed production by several millions of barrels a day. Gas will find it's way back to $3 by mid-year. And you guys are right, oil speculators need to reigned in. Maybe Obama will "change" this practice.
 
Bama323 said:
I'm not an expert on oil markets and trading, but I believe that oil trading was deregulated to some degree in the late 90's or early 2000's to allow more speculation. Obviously, alot of these investors have no real tangible interest in the oil business, they simply speculate on oil as an investment or vehicle to make money...
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To understand commodities and futures, you have to understand their place in the overall market. Give this a quick read: link.

We have been here before, but with grain futures. The result, regulation that did nothing to stop the trading. In the end, these markets, like stock markets, are legalized gambling. The biggest difference - the odds can change if you bring enough money to the table. If we allow these markets to exist, they will be manipulated as much as money allows them to be manipulated. In other words, the only way to stop this is to end the commodities exchanges. That, for many reasons, is not going to happen. If we stop it in America, it will just take place overseas. If we "over-regulate" our market, the ICE (Intercontinental Exchange) will just close its US operations. The IPE (International Petroleum Exchange) is already based in London, so not subject to our regulations...

This is what happens in a large marketplace, where everyone's concerns are addressed, not just America's...
 
wardaddy said:
Now from that time the Arabs have slashed production by several millions of barrels a day. Gas will find it's way back to $3 by mid-year. And you guys are right, oil speculators need to reigned in. Maybe Obama will "change" this practice.
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I don't think that gas will get that high again for several more years. The highest it might go is $2.50, simply because the demand is down and will stay down until the economy improves.

Gas cannot, and will not, get above $4.00 a gallon again without a legitimate energy crisis, e.g. the OPEC cuts of the 1970s. The economy cannot take another blow like that in this environment.
 
OPEC, has always seemed corrupt to me. I could never forgive them of what they did last summer!!!
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BamaJama17 said:
OPEC, has always seemed corrupt to me. I could never forgive them of what they did last summer!!!
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They are what they are - a cartel working together to provide a commodity at the highest possible price they can achieve. That isn't corruption. They are very open about it. They do not lie, cheat or steal. They just are.

Now, you could take issue with their near monopoly, but we can do nothing about that short of going to war and seizing those commodities...
 
NYBamaFan said:
They are what they are - a cartel working together to provide a commodity at the highest possible price they can achieve. That isn't corruption. They are very open about it. They do not lie, cheat or steal. They just are.

Now, you could take issue with their near monopoly, but we can do nothing about that short of going to war and seizing those commodities...
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I know, it hurts right???

Well the only way we ever go to war with them is if we have a President with balls to do so.
 
BamaScooter16 said:
I'm not saying HE himself did it. I'm saying he turned a blind eye to the wall street speculators and the oil companies.

I am a democrat, if you havent noticed, so don;t try to convince me Bush was given a bad rep by the media. In 30 or 40 years history will remember him as a puppet of corporate america, alot like Herbert Hoover in 1930. History will also remember the early 2000s as a time where corporate greed ran rampant and unchecked.
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Unchecked?

Remember these organizations, ones who were busted while Bush was president?

Qwest
Enron
Tyco
Adelphia
Worldcom
HealthSouth

Heck, even Martha Stewart got her butt tossed in jail.

You think all of these scandals started while Bush was in office? I'm pretty sure the 1990's were really "kind" to these companies. BTW, I'm not saying Clinton is responsible. I for one believe the president isn't to blame for all that goes wrong in this country. Nor should he get credit for all that goes right.
 
TiderB said:
Unchecked?

Remember these organizations, ones who were busted while Bush was president?

Qwest
Enron
Tyco
Adelphia
Worldcom
HealthSouth

Heck, even Martha Stewart got her butt tossed in jail.

You think all of these scandals started while Bush was in office? I'm pretty sure the 1990's were really "kind" to these companies. BTW, I'm not saying Clinton is responsible. I for one believe the president isn't to blame for all that goes wrong in this country. Nor should he get credit for all that goes right.
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Every one of those companies was guilty of participating in accounting scandals to make them seem more profitable than they really were, which is a direct result of the lack of regulation and oversight the Bush administration encouraged.

Now I'm not saying that Bush or any of his agents told those companies to do that (well, except maybe Enron). However, he did turn a blind eye while these corporations squandered billions of dollars on bad loans and executive bonuses. How do you think Wall Street crashed? Because there was no oversight or willingness to warn the government that the unbridaled greed of these institutions was sending the US economy straight to the toilet.
 
How exactly did Bush turn a blind eye? What these guys did was already illegal, long before Bush took office. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Healthsouth and Enron were crooked under Clinton too.
 
BamaScooter16 said:
I don't think that gas will get that high again for several more years. The highest it might go is $2.50, simply because the demand is down and will stay down until the economy improves.

Gas cannot, and will not, get above $4.00 a gallon again without a legitimate energy crisis, e.g. the OPEC cuts of the 1970s. The economy cannot take another blow like that in this environment.
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Nope, the people that have been appointed recently to run our energy department has openly stated that they would like the price of fuel to equal the European markets. Obama has said that he did not have a problem with gas at $4.00 a gallon. They are already looking to raise the gas tax by 50%. Kerry and Gore has stated that they would like to see the gas tax even higher than that.
So tell my why you believe that it will not get that high.
 
BamaScooter16 said:
Every one of those companies was guilty of participating in accounting scandals to make them seem more profitable than they really were, which is a direct result of the lack of regulation and oversight the Bush administration encouraged.

Now I'm not saying that Bush or any of his agents told those companies to do that (well, except maybe Enron). However, he did turn a blind eye while these corporations squandered billions of dollars on bad loans and executive bonuses. How do you think Wall Street crashed? Because there was no oversight or willingness to warn the government that the unbridaled greed of these institutions was sending the US economy straight to the toilet.
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If Bush's policies protected these companies, THEN HOW DID THEY GET CONVICTED? Are you another one of these that finds a way to blame Bush for everything? I am definitely not a fan of his but it was under his Presidency that they were brought to justice. Not under Clinto when they were committing the illegal acts also. And no, I don't blame it on Clinton either.
 
There may be another factor to higher gas prices in the future related to the auto industry bail-out. The crux of the story is the auto industry has spent billions on hybrid technology and they're afraid those vehicles won't sell with gas prices at its current levels.

The fear of producing the wrong cars has created a whisper campaign, with industry officials saying they may approach the incoming Obama administration about raising the federal gasoline tax or setting up a system that keeps the price of oil above a certain level.
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Changing gas prices make it tougher for car makers - LA Daily News
 
Also factor in that oil production from non-OPEC countries is peaking, the world will soon be relying on OPEC countries to supply the world's petroleum needs.
 
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