JFK assassination files released

[selmaborntidefan]

It's already been said about Jack Kennedy - he made a lot of enemies, either by himself or by proxy with his brother Robert. The mob, Cuban expats in Miami, and some theorize a black ops from the CIA. Or if he was a double-agent himself. (Unheard of since in the Oval Office )

One of my favorites in the 1970s was this:

Democrats on Watergate:
"No President is above the law, and we must have public hearings so the public knows what their elected officials blah blah blah and that's all."

Democrats on CIA and Kennedy Excesses at the same time as Watergate:
"We must have CLOSED DOOR HEARINGS on this because national security! And because I, Frank Church, want to be President someday and there's no way in hell I can get elected if I'm seen on TV telling the whole world about all the assassination talk the Kennedy brothers were making!"

 

[CrimsonJazz]

(The part I've NEVER understood is this: we are told repeatedly that LBJ or the military industrial complex were behind this so we could go to war, so wouldn't it have made A LOT MORE SENSE if one is creating a story to rouse up public support with "hey, this country did this"?)

Good question, but one that is predicated on the notion that everyone in the corridors of power wanted Vietnam to be ramped up into a total war. I think one can make the argument that there were plenty of people who did not want that (Kennedy among them.) This is why Oliver Stone's theory wasn't all that satisfactory to a lot of people. The Vietnam escalation could be considered an outcome from the assassination, but I'm having a hard time swallowing the idea that this is why he got whacked.

In his short political life, JFK managed to thoroughly tick off 5 of the scariest groups of people on the entire planet: The CIA, the mafia, the KGB, the Cubans and the nation's billionaires and bankers. All of them wanted the guy dead and all of them had the means of making that happen, but that's where the similarity among them ends. There is no shortage of suspects. This is why I like to keep up with this sort of thing. We will never really know for sure what happened, but I like to think that we can expose a lot of things that Americans should know about. A lot of the dirty tricks the CIA was up to back then are, most likely, still in use today.

Really?

What disappeared?
And how do you know this?
And if you know what disappeared, it could hardly have been a secret.

(This always amuses me - "the government covered it up but they weren't counting on the Zapruder film." Uh, you mean the same Zapruder film the government used?)

There seem to be a lot of sequential issues people are finding. There are missing documents which means that either all the files haven't been released or at some point, some of them have been lifted. I know that Clinton's ARRB had access to much of this, so I tossed a theory out there regarding when some of them could have been taken.

Of course, it was Rubio who was crapping his pants during Trump's first term when the idea was being tossed about to release those files. Rubio talked Trump into not doing what he said he would do and that was that. Fast forward 4 years and now Trump IS doing it and Rubio has been strangely silent. I wonder what changed?

In any case, I don't claim to have any answers. I've read countless books and watched many documentaries on the subject and the only thing I know is that I don't know. I doubt there's anyone alive who does.

 

[Its On A Slab]

My favorite JFK conspiracy theory posited that Johnson shot Kennedy from the trailing limo.

 

[DzynKingRTR]

My favorite JFK conspiracy theory posited that Johnson shot Kennedy from the trailing limo.

That is just silly. Everybody knows the cigarette smoking man did it.

 

[CrimsonJazz]

That is just silly. Everybody knows the cigarette smoking man did it.

I thought that was a nice touch in that episode. He was a great antagonist in that show.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

Good question, but one that is predicated on the notion that everyone in the corridors of power wanted Vietnam to be ramped up into a total war.

And was in generic response to that point.

I think one can make the argument that there were plenty of people who did not want that (Kennedy among them.) This is why Oliver Stone's theory wasn't all that satisfactory to a lot of people. The Vietnam escalation could be considered an outcome from the assassination, but I'm having a hard time swallowing the idea that this is why he got whacked.

I don't even believe this particular aspect.

This "after-the-fact" notion that JFK would never have gotten us involved in that war has always been specious at best. To me, it's right there with the "Bobby Kennedy would have won in 1968" myth. First, we'll never know and second, probably not.

In his short political life, JFK managed to thoroughly tick off 5 of the scariest groups of people on the entire planet: The CIA, the mafia, the KGB, the Cubans and the nation's billionaires and bankers. All of them wanted the guy dead and all of them had the means of making that happen, but that's where the similarity among them ends. There is no shortage of suspects. This is why I like to keep up with this sort of thing.

I think this is nothing more than 90% Hollywood and 10% substance, though.

NOTHING - no matter how folks argue this - REALLY changed in the 1960s. All that really happened was TV news cameras could show us an actual war and peek behind the private lives of Presidents. It's sorta like now - "oh, this never happened" isn't "really" true. We just didn't have cell phones.

I'm compiling stories from the 70s on what we now call "mass shootings" and despite the alarmist rhetoric of the news channels, they DID happen back then. It's just that if I lived in Selma, Alabama in 1979, the only way I was going to hear about a mass shooting in Kennewick, Washington was if there was an unusually high kill count like the McDonald's shooter in San Diego in 1984.

We will never really know for sure what happened,

We absolutely DO know what happened: Oswald fired the gun and killed Kennedy. The part we don't know for sure is the why and if there was a "for whom."

but I like to think that we can expose a lot of things that Americans should know about. A lot of the dirty tricks the CIA was up to back then are, most likely, still in use today.

No, we can't.

Because if THAT is the argument then one can go with "the CIA manufactured those documents to make something look like something." Possible? Sure, and it would be easier now.

Anyway, thanks for the interaction.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

My favorite JFK conspiracy theory posited that Johnson shot Kennedy from the trailing limo.

Mine was the idea that, YES, Oswald was shooting but the kill shot was a discharged round from a Secret Service agent along the route. It reminded me of the James Bond movie "The Living Daylights" when the bad guy shows up to murder Pushkin and then Bond shoots him in a put-up job.

 

[DzynKingRTR]

Mine was the idea that, YES, Oswald was shooting but the kill shot was a discharged round from a Secret Service agent along the route. It reminded me of the James Bond movie "The Living Daylights" when the bad guy shows up to murder Pushkin and then Bond shoots him in a put-up job.

Yeah, I have heard this one too. but it makes me think of Barney Fife.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

Yeah, I have heard this one too. but it makes me think of Barney Fife.

ESpecially, since he only had one bullet 😆

 

[selmaborntidefan]

That is just silly. Everybody knows the cigarette smoking man did it.

The guy with the umbrella....

 

[selmaborntidefan]

I’m thinking nothing of great significance will come out of this.

Let's go one further.

There are NOT thousands of sealed documents about the alleged October Surprise theory that Reagan's campaign conspired with Iran to hold the hostages until after the election - and yet there are still thousands if not millions of Americans who believe this despite far less evidence substantiating it than can be found regarding any alleged JFK conspiracy, largely depending upon which way they lean politically. There has never been anything beyond speculation produced as evidence - and the Democratic controlled House and Senate that had NO REASON to cover up such a crime (and every reason to say it happened) spent multiplied millions investigating it and came up with nothing.

But tying it back to JFK, that's my point. None of us can EVER prove something DID NOT happen.
I can't prove that James Earl Ray was NOT "set up" by Raoul any more than someone can prove Arthur Bremer was NOT a hired gun for the Black Muslims to kill George Wallace.

What we're left with is what we have EVIDENCE of, and the EVIDENCE points to one shooter named Oswald and "more likely than not" just because.

 

[arthurdawg]

That is just silly. Everybody knows the cigarette smoking man did it.

It is more likely that this is the case than. most of the conspiracies!

 

[Its On A Slab]

I thought that was a nice touch in that episode. He was a great antagonist in that show.

My favorite part of that show was when he would appear, usually in the dark, smoking those cancer sticks. Always with that sinister, biting wit.

 

[mdb-tpet]

The best part is they just released a ton of Social Security numbers and addresses for still very much alive politicians in the batch. And of course like clockwork, the sensitive guy at the top will lie, make up a fake excuse, or blame someone else.

Trump defends the release of Social Security numbers in JFK files: 'We gave everything'

President Donald Trump is defending the release of Social Security numbers that were made public through the JFK files.

www.usatoday.com

 

[CrimsonJazz]

My favorite part of that show was when he would appear, usually in the dark, smoking those cancer sticks. Always with that sinister, biting wit.

We just don’t see villains like that anymore….at least not on TV.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

In the least shocking thing possible....

Donald Trump asks if Lee Harvey Oswald was helped in assassinating John F. Kennedy

I mean, a guy who thinks a political party stole an election from him in select states but forgot to steal Senate and House seats will be all over the place.

 

[arthurdawg]

We just don’t see villains like that anymore….at least not on TV.

I loved how they portrayed him... And that he seemed to regret most of what he did and what his life was, but he still did it. Much better than some cartoon character.

 

[Its On A Slab]

I loved how they portrayed him... And that he seemed to regret most of what he did and what his life was, but he still did it. Much better than some cartoon character.

We went back and rewatched the entire series again about a year or so ago. I am not a fan of the Robert Patrick episodes, but the Muller/Scully episodes are awesome.

Yeah, I liked that episode dedicated to The Cigarette Smoking Man's life("Musings Of A Cigarette Smoking Man"). One of my favorite villains of all time.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

Well, there's been a deafening silence since the release. Either (1) the press has forgotten how to read (quite possible), or (2) there's nothing there.

Notwithstanding my doubts about the press's ability to read anymore, I'm going with nothing there.

Otherwise, somebody would be trying to make his/her Woodward-and-Bernstein bones by shouting their findings from the peak of the highest mountain -- or most-followed social media site.

 

[selmaborntidefan]

Well, there's been a deafening silence since the release. Either (1) the press has forgotten how to read (quite possible), or (2) there's nothing there.

Notwithstanding my doubts about the press's ability to read anymore, I'm going with nothing there.

Otherwise, somebody would be trying to make his/her Woodward-and-Bernstein bones by shouting their findings from the peak of the highest mountain -- or most-followed social media site.

There’s no money in “Oswald did it.” But concoct a conspiracy theory, write a book, print a few pictures and let the dough roll in. Play upon the suspicion people already have of government, twist it a bit and voila!

To me it’s sort of like the fact that really good Bible teachers, there’s NO audience for them nationally. In a small area, sure. But for a national “ministry”, it’s faith healers, entertainment, chasing the devil off the stage, knocking down people with your coat, and having a good storyteller with a southern accent.