My biggest concern with the program re: coaches

[alatider]

Remember that the coaches don't play the game - the players do.

I say that we should be patient and wait until next year and the year after when Saban has his players playing.

Look at Kentucky. Brooks now has his players playing and they are doing fairly well.

Just a thought.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

they are soft and lazy.

They are neither. I'm getting damned tired of people who don't know what they're talking about repeating that lie - and particularly when they've been a member for a month and have a single digit post count. You post that crap again, and you're gone. In fact, I'm going back to look at the rest of your posts now...

 

[rolltideas]

The guys I know say they have never worked harder in their life. One player even said his fingers constantly cramped because they were working out so hard. He also thought it was making him and the rest of the guys see what 110% was all about.

 

[TIDE-HSV]

I've heard the same, but we still are having folks post to the contrary, without knowing the facts at all...

 

[bamafaninbham]

Tide-HSV, can you put a finger on why the team is in this downward spiral. I've read everyone elses hunches and guesses, but I'd like to hear your insight on the present situation.

Thanks

 

[Big_Fan]

I've heard the same, but we still are having folks post to the contrary, without knowing the facts at all...

One of the distinguishing characteristics between prospects, is potential...not just the "where are they now," that we seem to dwell on. Some guys will never have 500# bench press or 700# squat lifts. The stronger HS players can often develop into those monsters, and weaker ones will probably not, no matter how hard they work. I was always extremely strong on leg lifts, and only moderately strong on upper body - no matter how hard I worked - my bench never got past the mid 300's, but I could squat 700# when I got to JSU as a frosh...genetics, I guess. I worked out my upper body harder than my lower but never even sniffed 400# on bench. We need OL who are capable of attaining Smiley numbers while maintaining agility.

I don't know where Capps numbers are now, but I do know that we had incoming freshmen last year who were stronger. That really said something about our S&C under Shula...and Capps may not have the genetics to be a monster.

Recruiting over the next 3 classes will provide the fuel we need for Saban's spark to ignite us.

 

[bamadoc94]

I too was a big fan of pollard, but I don't know that his philosophies would mesh with CNS's philosophy the way they did with Fran or the way Croom coaches. Fran wanted lots of mass, remember we were a run first offense with a line to compliment that. CMS and CNS both were looking for a different type of build, they want guys who are lean and agile, not jut BIG. This is necessary for pass blocking which seems to be the direction our offense is leaning. That is not to say that Pollard could not change his methods, but he and Fran were a perfect fit, and it would appear MSU is a good fit as well. We still want good size, but Cochran's experience working with basketball players where agility is so important appeals to what CNS wants. It is also believed that there are usually fewer injuries when balancing the heavy lifting, and bulking up with a muscle endurance and agility program.

 

[TexasTideFan]

To echo both Earle & Jess at least Nick has the players showing up for weight training.

It's a night and day difference with our current S&C Program versus the one under Shula. Workouts are posted on screens and they keep assistants at all the stations to assist. Strength training is now an emphasis instead of a by-product in maybe one of the finest facilities in the SEC. Meals are even planned for players. Plus, the cardio is a killer. Back in the Spring, they were doing all kinds of football related cardio drills and the players were gasping like fish out of water. They were even doing karate once a week over the Summer, which btw is an excellent way to improve flexibility.

As for Ben, he is one of the greatest S&C coaches in the business and IMO was a big reason we dominated the LOS on both sides of the ball and put so many guys off those 2001 and 2002 Fran teams in the League. One of the guys I used to powerlift with worked with him and they are still close. He said that getting rid of him was the worst mistake we could have made because our guys in the trenches would get soft. I wonder if he was right?

 

[TIDE-HSV]

99% of the guys have worked their finger to the bone, and I swear to god, the next guy who posts "soft" gets banned forever. They deserve more, particularly from folks who don't know what's taken place on the ground in T-Town. I was asked to put a finger on what's wrong. It's 80% mental from learning the wrong lessons. The other 20% is poor talent in very crucial positions...

 

[UA All the Way]

Maybe someone who knows S&C better can answer this...how long does it typically take for players to rebound from where we were at the end of last season and get on par with the rest of the division? Does it take more than a year of this new S&C to make up for lost time? How close are we?

 

[Tide n True]

I don't think any of our players are soft...they could probably whip anyone who would dare to climb out from behind the computer and say it to their face. I have heard, unfortunately, that AS was putting on some pounds...

 

[TIDE-HSV]

AS is, unfortunately, one of those individuals who, because of genetics and upbringing, will always battle weight. I don't think that we've caught up yet, and I don't think we will, with our present players. Gaining muscle mass is a talent also, and we have some trench players I don't think can gain, and that's not because I don't appreciate their efforts as players. We've had various self-proclaimed experts come on this site and proclaim that stupendous gains can be made in a short time. However, being a bit cynical, that's their business and that's the concept they're in the business to sell. From watching FB and training methods for a long time (and being a weight trainer from age 12 to, almost, age 68), I think it takes at least a solid year to catch up. And the other teams aren't exactly sitting still, waiting for us to catch up. And, in some positions, we will need the next generation to step up...

 

[Big_Fan]

AS is, unfortunately, one of those individuals who, because of genetics and upbringing, will always battle weight. I don't think that we've caught up yet, and I don't think we will, with our present players. Gaining muscle mass is a talent also, and we have some trench players I don't think can gain, and that's not because I don't appreciate their efforts as players. We've had various self-proclaimed experts come on this site and proclaim that stupendous gains can be made in a short time. However, being a bit cynical, that's their business and that's the concept they're in the business to sell. From watching FB and training methods for a long time (and being a weight trainer from age 12 to, almost, age 68), I think it takes at least a solid year to catch up. And the other teams aren't exactly sitting still, waiting for us to catch up. And, in some positions, we will need the next generation to step up...

Yep. In 2001 we were improved from a physical standpoint...more effective late in the games...in 2002 we were physically dominant. I hope for a repeat of that next season.

 

[Bama1970]

TIDE-HSV, i agree completely with you that the players are not soft this year. Now last year and the few years before may be a different story, but anyone can see the vast improvement in S&C this year. And yes, it is going to take some butt kicking work in the weigh room for the current players to catch up to the other teams in the SEC as far as strength is concerned. Conditioning can be attained much faster than strength. Our previous S&C program hurt the incoming players alot IMO, as they basically got a year behind the other schools incoming freshman as far as strength is concerned. With our current S&C program, while the current players are still behind, yet improving, I think our incoming guys (07 and 08) will be on par with their counterparts at other schools. This alone, IMO, will help close the gap tremendously with our competition, who up to this point seem to always win the "battle of the trenches".