QB Competition 2018

[TiderJack]

You guys are pretty tough to please. I acknowledged some of these variables. But, if we are going to have any raw data to compare them, we'd have to do it when they played the same defenses.

I'd say Tua's stats were probably deflated somewhat because he played near the end of these games, we really started shutting down the offense. Case in point, although Tua entered the game early in the 4th quarter against Arkansas, he only threw 2 passes (1-2). Hidden in this was a backwards pass to Josh Jacobs that went for about 50 yards that doesn't show in the stats because it would have gone in the books as a handoff, but it was a backward swing pass thrown perfectly.

I'd venture to say that if he had played at the beginning of these games with the same amount of reps as Jalen his numbers would be even better. Yes, this is speculation, but with his fundamentals and accuracy and willingness to throw it in tight spaces, his attempts would likely be higher than Jalen's and therefore his yardages and td rates would be greater.

Also, after looking at the stats that compared their play against the same defense. I failed to mention that in two of those games Tua had very limited reps.

As mentioned, against Arkansas, he only had 2 attempts. Against Col. St. he only had 1 completion in 4 attempts. This was the game that CNS put Jalen back in the game near the end with about 2 minutes left, which was strange even though we led 41-23. Tua had 1 of those 4 passes dropped by a tight end. He threw one bad pass that would have been a first down. Uncharacteristically, he threw it behind a wide open Najee Harris that would have made the a first down. However, all four passes called for Tua in this game were throws around the LOS rather than downfield. Not exactly using his skill set. BTW, this was the game CNS was so upset with the defense not being able to get off the field.

Not hard to please but you just are not going to change the minds of any of us who don't agree with your points. You have made the same points over and over in multiple posts for two straight weeks. We all know your position and it is cool but don't expect some of us that don't agree with you to all of a sudden say that you are right.

 

[RammerJammer14]

Based on the body language of the receivers when Tua is in the game... especially Ridley, I'd say they know who the better passer is.

Well, I don't particularly care who starts as long as we win but, perhaps it is time to toss the dice.

 

[CajunCrimson]

Well, I don't particularly care who starts as long as we win but, perhaps it is time to toss the dice.

Still believe we should have a half dozen plays with both in the game - Jalen in the pistol, Tua behind him in the Gun......2 wide outs, DH spread to the left....tons of fun

 

[TIDE-HSV]

Still believe we should have a half dozen plays with both in the game - Jalen in the pistol, Tua behind him in the Gun......2 wide outs, DH spread to the left....tons of fun

That's what I call real "fantasy football."

 

[TiderJack]

That's what I call real "fantasy football."

Malzhan would love that play :smile:

 

[NationalTitles18]

Well, I don't particularly care who starts as long as we win but, perhaps it is time to toss the dice.

I'm with you, brother.

 

[rgw]

Tua is a better passer than Hurts already. He’s just likely to make more mistakes at this juncture. Especially since he is confident in his arm.

 

[B1GTide]

Tua is a better passer than Hurts already. He’s just likely to make more mistakes at this juncture. Especially since he is confident in his arm.

Yep, he is the better passer, but is he the better QB? That is the question.

 

[BamaMoon]

Not hard to please but you just are not going to change the minds of any of us who don't agree with your points. You have made the same points over and over in multiple posts for two straight weeks. We all know your position and it is cool but don't expect some of us that don't agree with you to all of a sudden say that you are right.

I understand the differences of opinions. No problem. But to be fair, I'm not the only person who's spoken favorably of Tua though. And for the record, I've never said I don't like Jalen or hated on him (like some have asserted). I just think his play has been substandard and others have too.

And just one other thing. Someone started the fairy tale that if Tua played he'd be turnover prone and so this subthread was me just looking at comparative stats of them. Someone said the first analysis was flawed, so I tried again just comparing the actual games they both have played in. That was the context of "Some of you are tough to please."

 

[bodiddle]

I understand the differences of opinions. No problem. But to be fair, I'm not the only person who's spoken favorably of Tua though. And for the record, I've never said I don't like Jalen or hated on him (like some have asserted). I just think his play has been substandard and others have too.

And just one other thing. Someone started the fairy tale that if Tua played he'd be turnover prone and so this subthread was me just looking at comparative stats of them. Someone said the first analysis was flawed, so I tried again just comparing the actual games they both have played in. That was the context of "Some of you are tough to please."

Hey, you are totally good.

 

[CrimsonRuss]

I understand the differences of opinions. No problem. But to be fair, I'm not the only person who's spoken favorably of Tua though. And for the record, I've never said I don't like Jalen or hated on him (like some have asserted). I just think his play has been substandard and others have too.

And just one other thing. Someone started the fairy tale that if Tua played he'd be turnover prone and so this subthread was me just looking at comparative stats of them. Someone said the first analysis was flawed, so I tried again just comparing the actual games they both have played in. That was the context of "Some of you are tough to please."

You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make em drink... I totally agree with you. I think our talent at RB and WR dictate we should be running a pro style attack with a QB who can throw darts to the WR’s an handoff to our RB’s. In my opinion Tua is that QB. As you said earlier in this thread you can’t unsee this kids arm talent. I am hoping we see him in the Clemson game to fully utilize ALL our offensive weapons! Not to mention I think it would shock Clemson.

 

[BamaMoon]

You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make em drink... I totally agree with you. I think our talent at RB and WR dictate we should be running a pro style attack with a QB who can throw darts to the WR’s an handoff to our RB’s. In my opinion Tua is that QB. As you said earlier in this thread you can’t unsee this kids arm talent. I am hoping we see him in the Clemson game to fully utilize ALL our offensive weapons! Not to mention I think it would shock Clemson.

Who knows? I expect Hurts to start. But, if he struggles and we can't move the ball, make first downs, control the clock and obviously score more points than against Auburn, I hope Tua's talents are given a chance.

 

[4Q Basket Case]

Yep, he is the better passer, but is he the better QB? That is the question.

Depends on the opponent and the goal.

If it's a team we should beat, Hurts has proven he won't get in the way of the overwhelming talent by making game-changing mistakes.

If it's a team we can't dominate in the trenches, that's a really close call.

In that case, Hurts is less likely to get you beat with the crucial mistake. He is also less likely to win the game by making a play against 7-9 in the box.

It's Saban's job to strike the best balance, and I'm sure all of the above figured into his thought processes long ago.

The man's won 4 NCs in 10 completed years, and was out of the November conversation only twice -- one of those being the first year. I have to trust him.

 

[derek4tide]

So, what are the chances that CNS puts in Tua against Clemson? I’d say zero. I agree that Tua is the better pssser and would be starring at most SEC schools, however, I just don’t see CNS “rolling the dice.” I think he sticks with Jalen no matter what happens. Win or lose, he will ride that horse.

 

[uafanataum]

So, what are the chances that CNS puts in Tua against Clemson? I’d say zero. I agree that Tua is the better pssser and would be starring at most SEC schools, however, I just don’t see CNS “rolling the dice.” I think he sticks with Jalen no matter what happens. Win or lose, he will ride that horse.

Right. Hurts is the starter for the bowl games. I think he has proven himself to be an amazing athlete and a pretty good passer. Only problem is Tua is a better passrr. However, I wonder why people have not considered the idea that Jalen could be a better passer after a month of practice, or by next spring. Aj McCarron has become a better passer in his NFL career than he was in his college career. He had FIVE years at Alabama but is still better in his NFL career. Why do people think that January Jalen will be the same as November Jalen?

 

[CrimsonProf]

So, what are the chances that CNS puts in Tua against Clemson? I’d say zero. I agree that Tua is the better pssser and would be starring at most SEC schools, however, I just don’t see CNS “rolling the dice.” I think he sticks with Jalen no matter what happens. Win or lose, he will ride that horse.

If we lose to Clemson in similar fashion to the Auburn game - and Tua never plays - it will mark the beginning of the end of this dynasty.


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[TIDE-HSV]

Right. Hurts is the starter for the bowl games. I think he has proven himself to be an amazing athlete and a pretty good passer. Only problem is Tua is a better passrr. However, I wonder why people have not considered the idea that Jalen could be a better passer after a month of practice, or by next spring. Aj McCarron has become a better passer in his NFL career than he was in his college career. He had FIVE years at Alabama but is still better in his NFL career. Why do people think that January Jalen will be the same as November Jalen?

Well, probably the team is worrying more than the fans, after the AU game, although, as I've said several times, all seems fine with the team at the moment. I really don't see the issue being which is the better passer. The issue is carrying out the plays as called and not changing them into all "QB now runs." I'm sure that's being worked on right now through to game time. Coach has referred to Hurts as "very coachable." Now's the time for that to be proven...

 

[rgw]

I'm not so apocalyptic but I do think it is a very bad omen if the same thing that got us beat against Auburn is still happening after a month off. It may just be bad omen for some of the offensive staff more than the program itself.

 

[JDCrimson]

If we lose to Clemson in similar fashion to the Auburn game - and Tua never plays - it will mark the beginning of the end of this dynasty.


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That is why I think we play both of them regardless. Jalen knows that Tua is coming hard in his rear view mirror. My concern now is Jalen plays more to try and hold the position than to win and accept that he needs all his teammates to win including Tua. Save the competition for the spring and everyone pull together to get 17.

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[uafanataum]

If we lose to Clemson in similar fashion to the Auburn game - and Tua never plays - it will mark the beginning of the end of this dynasty.


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Not sure on that. CNS has altered his defense to adapt to the spread hunh offenses. He has changed his offenses also. If he does lose then i think it could be the catalyst for another change. I think he will always do what he needs to win.